2016 Postmortem

SFnomad

(3,473 posts)

87. Yes, you're building strawmen ... you stated ...

Mon Jan 9, 2017, 12:16 AM

Jan 2017

Because I refuse to side with those who maintain everything would be great, if we could just get rid of criticism.

I have seen no one state we need to get rid of criticism .... NO ONE. And since that's the argument you just made, that's the very definition of a strawman. But also around here, I have seen BS cheerleaders continue with the same crap they were trying to peddle back during the primaries. It didn't float then, it won't float now.

Now, when Clinton can beat tRump in the popular vote by nearly 3 MILLION people and if she received another 100,000 votes across 3 states that she lost, we'd be talking about President-Elect Clinton right now. Just 100,000 votes ... you realize that is less than one tenth of 1% of all the votes cast, don't you? That isn't WRECKAGE that needs to be picked up.

When Gore won the popular, but lost the EC, both the EC and the popular were reasonably close. This time, Clinton beat tRump by nearly 3 million votes ... 2 whole percentage points ... and lost the EC convincingly. What that should be telling you is our electoral system is broken. We've now had 2 elections in less than 20 years that have had this "anomaly" ... it's no longer an anomaly, it's a feature. And because RepubliCONs have benefitted of this anomaly, you can bet they won't want to change a thing.

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Bernie supporters try to make something of the wreckage. [View all] HassleCat Dec 2016 OP

Where is your area TrekLuver Dec 2016 #1

Olympic peninsula of Washington HassleCat Dec 2016 #2

Sad to hear that since he isn't a Party member scscholar Jan 2017 #27

We need to support anyone who will help us. HassleCat Jan 2017 #31

Well, the party has him in leadership now. Glad they don't have a problem with labels. snowy owl Jan 2017 #49

Exactly!! InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2017 #101

Yes, maybe Debbie Wasserman Schultz can come to WA state and lecture the voters there Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #53

I happen to think pot should be legal. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #73

She also was the public face of our party, and went to the Times (a national media outlet) in July Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #88

Pot's still illegal in WA under federal law NobodyHere Jan 2017 #98

Hmmm, You sound excited. Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #113

Not excited NobodyHere Jan 2017 #114

Oh, As am I. Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #117

One hopes that those who voted for Trump for such a foolish reason or didn't vote enjoy the much Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #121

Sessions is right about one thing, Congress ought to rectify the conflict btw. Federal and State law Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #122

No it won't happen under a GOP administration... Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #123

A LOT of Bernie supporters ARE democrats! hollowdweller Jan 2017 #116

That's good news. We need the young to stay energized. snowy owl Jan 2017 #50

I think perhaps a reality check might help a bit more. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #74

A bit contradictory: it takes energized people to work towards next election...and beyond. snowy owl Jan 2017 #82

It also take a reality based approach...in order to get something done...for all Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #118

No, a million times no! Kentonio Jan 2017 #95

YES! Locrian Jan 2017 #110

How about try for what we can get since the GOP are about to unleash hell on earth. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #119

No. Save the compromises for after the election. killbotfactory Jan 2017 #124

Today we are going to lose health care...30 million direct Obamacare Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #132

Let them try. It must start somewhere. The Wielding Truth Jan 2017 #126

Is port Townsend in that area. I have friends there. pangaia Dec 2016 #3

Yes HassleCat Dec 2016 #4

Thanks I'll pass the word pangaia Dec 2016 #5

here, here NJCher Dec 2016 #6

If we could get Rank Choice Voting nation wide I think the message would select the candidate not Snotcicles Jan 2017 #92

K&R NCTraveler Dec 2016 #7

Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #8

That's great. progressoid Dec 2016 #9

Great to hear. Bernie folks are very active here in Western Oregon as well. jalan48 Dec 2016 #10

WA, CA, and OR all set an example for the rest of the country pnwmom Dec 2016 #19

Not sure about this "taking over" (interesting response though). jalan48 Dec 2016 #21

Since "wreckage" and "taking over" were both in the OP, I would say it's an appropriate response SFnomad Jan 2017 #38

Sorry-I was referring to where I live in Oregon but I see what you mean. jalan48 Jan 2017 #40

Yes, and supporting personal freedom, free speech, marijuana legalization, an open internet, etc Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #55

You're complaining because they're doing something? babylonsister Dec 2016 #11

I saw them try to" take over" the non-representative caucuses, pnwmom Dec 2016 #20

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #23

Yes, Bernie voters were more energized. Is that a problem? Why alienating? snowy owl Jan 2017 #52

I was objecting to the idea of applauding them for "taking over." pnwmom Jan 2017 #63

I don't think you can generalize. I'm in Seattle and mine were diverse with a fair # of old people snowy owl Jan 2017 #67

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2016 #22

real change starts at local level and builds up JI7 Dec 2016 #12

That area Hillary carried handily. So why do you think Bernie supporters pnwmom Dec 2016 #13

They're trying to energize the party HassleCat Dec 2016 #14

Again, what will that accomplish in WA? Especially that part of WA? pnwmom Dec 2016 #15

A more diverse crowd HassleCat Dec 2016 #16

We are a state with a Democratic governor, two Democratic women Senators, pnwmom Dec 2016 #17

Thank you, pnwmom! I read this OP and shook my head thinking of how divisive R B Garr Dec 2016 #18

arent these the same people who got themselves made voting members of the EC then announced pkdu Jan 2017 #29

Then why does he have a leadership role within the party? Exilednight Jan 2017 #54

More involvement by more people... Orsino Jan 2017 #100

In the real world, there is no evidence that Sanders brought in new voters Gothmog Jan 2017 #104

True. But the post claimed that our state is in "wreckage" and it's not. pnwmom Jan 2017 #108

Great post Gothmog Jan 2017 #103

And in the two states that had both primaries and caucuses, HRC won the primaries. pnwmom Jan 2017 #109

+1 nt jonno99 Jan 2017 #106

You NEVER stop building and expanding the party EVERYWHERE!!!!! Don't you get it??? RBInMaine Jan 2017 #32

And don't you get it that some of those people are connected pnwmom Jan 2017 #35

But perhaps there are areas that might be prioritized and it would seem Blue states are not Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #76

We could start by having our next DNC chair be someone who doesnt want granny in prison Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #56

What does that have to do with Bernie supporters trying to take over pnwmom Jan 2017 #59

Some people here seem to think that the beltway knows better. Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #61

I don't think our Bernie supporter elector who announced as soon as Hillary won pnwmom Jan 2017 #62

Fair enough. Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #64

Which WA State Democrats work with Adelson? n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #65

None, because our west coast State Democratic parties dont support putting cancer grannies in prison Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #85

It would seem if they really want to help...they would pick purple or red states...not Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #75

Taking Over States Where We Are Already Strong? Does Not Sound pro-Democratic Party. n/t delisen Jan 2017 #28

YES because you have to KEEP and EXPAND those places with NEW ideas and NEW people!!!!! RBInMaine Jan 2017 #33

You aren't here. You don't know what the situation is. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #36

You mean the thinknig that got people elected in your state? Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #72

I hope they get rid of the caucuses. n/t LisaM Jan 2017 #24

I'm a Bernie supporter who agrees with you. One of many, btw. PotatoChip Jan 2017 #37

Yes. LisaM Jan 2017 #48

Depends... kenfrequed Jan 2017 #94

+1 nt jonno99 Jan 2017 #107

Money's influence on election results has long been vastly overstated. Garrett78 Jan 2017 #25

Sanders out spent Clinton by a decent amount in many if not all of the later primaries Gothmog Jan 2017 #105

Would have been much easier to do if our government wasnt now in the hands Eliot Rosewater Jan 2017 #26

No...why the pure tell us that...from the ashes a new Democratic Party will arise... Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #46

I stopped reading at "barely lost the electoral college". She lost by 73 electoral votes. Exilednight Jan 2017 #57

She lost by less than 100,000 votes in six states...that is barely losing Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #66

Horrid Blue State Democratic Entrenchers! Tell us more! delisen Jan 2017 #30

If this area were in eastern Washington Chitown Kev Jan 2017 #34

If this area were in Texas or Utah or Georgia, it would be more impressive SFnomad Jan 2017 #39

Right trying to get rid of winning Democrats and replace Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #45

I've stated many times that the BS cheerleaders are a lot like the Tbaggers SFnomad Jan 2017 #47

Exactly right...and the consequences are horrible for real people...these people Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #68

Okay. So what happens in 2020 if Gavin Newsom runs for the nomination for POTUS? Warren DeMontague Jan 2017 #58

That makes no sense. Obama was born in Hawaii Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #71

I have no problem with Bernie supporters mobilizing to overtake the Republicans. Fla Dem Jan 2017 #41

If Sanders supporters are taking over the local Democratic party portlander23 Jan 2017 #51

They Had To Tear It Down First otohara Jan 2017 #42

Money may not win elections but the lack of it surely will lose elecdtions. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #43

They won't win. They will continue to rely on the same corporate institutions and then those JCanete Jan 2017 #44

They almost won this time. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #69

it is not just banks and I don't think that is his sole obsession. It is corporatocracy, which JCanete Jan 2017 #91

How would you do that...and still come up with mone to fund our people...I understand your point. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #120

That is THE question. I'll respond later, but wanted you to know I wasn't just ignoring the question JCanete Jan 2017 #125

It would nice if Bernie supporters went after Republicans rather than Democratic party members BlueStateLib Jan 2017 #60

Trump is inspiring people to volunteer for progressive causes all over the map. killbotfactory Jan 2017 #70

If the BS cheerleaders went after tRump with as much gusto as they're STILL going after Clinton ... SFnomad Jan 2017 #77

If I could, I would broker a deal. HassleCat Jan 2017 #78

Well ... maybe you should stop posting OPs that talk about "making something out of the WRECKAGE" SFnomad Jan 2017 #79

Yes, I am the problem. HassleCat Jan 2017 #80

I didn't say you were the problem .. I said PART of the problem ... but go ahead, misquote me SFnomad Jan 2017 #84

OK. Didn't mean to hog all the glory. HassleCat Jan 2017 #86

Yes, you're building strawmen ... you stated ... SFnomad Jan 2017 #87

But if, if, if.. Kentonio Jan 2017 #96

And around and around we go ... SFnomad Jan 2017 #99

That's right, none of this is you guys fault, it's all someone elses.. Kentonio Jan 2017 #111

And it's clear you have reading comprehension problems n/t SFnomad Jan 2017 #112

+1 betsuni Jan 2017 #115

Washington State? Where 3 electors voted for Colin Powell instead of Hillary?...nt SidDithers Jan 2017 #81

Yes, that was wrong. HassleCat Jan 2017 #83

Bernie works so hard HoneyBadger Jan 2017 #89

K&R mvd Jan 2017 #90

If they want to affect change, that is how it is done. Adrahil Jan 2017 #93

And which area do you live in? Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #97

Great post HC! I do think Bernie was the one to show us the way out of the political wilderness, but, I'm surely open to new blood who can continue what Bernie started. InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2017 #102

I'm glad to know ... NanceGreggs Jan 2017 #127

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2017 #128

Bernie had "wide appeal". NanceGreggs Jan 2017 #129

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2017 #130

All I'll say is the Bernie supporters would do well to remember the ground rules Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #131