2016 Postmortem

realmirage

(2,117 posts)

121. I actually hear people telling me loyalty is more important than principle. It's insane

Reply to Feeling the Bern (Reply #116)

Sun Dec 18, 2016, 08:39 PM

Dec 2016

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I fear Democrats are laying the groundwork for future losses by refusing to learn from defeat [View all] realmirage Dec 2016 OP

You might like WhiteTara Dec 2016 #1

keep laying that groundwork. Maybe you like defeat. I don't realmirage Dec 2016 #2

Well, join the Party WhiteTara Dec 2016 #3

Again, address the OP or don't bother replying realmirage Dec 2016 #8

Yes, Sir! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #15

address the OP or stop replying, this is my last to you realmirage Dec 2016 #16

Obeisances to you My Overlord! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #17

lol. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #200

This message was self-deleted by its author emulatorloo Dec 2016 #204

Some of us did derby378 Dec 2016 #137

Because one can't participate in an online forum AND engage with their local party, too. CrispyQ Dec 2016 #158

agreed. n/t. okieinpain Dec 2016 #201

Maybe you like defeat? did you vote for bernie? because she beat the shit of bernie and his bro's! stonecutter357 Dec 2016 #56

I voted for Hillary, who got beat as well realmirage Dec 2016 #62

Yet she lost to trump.. in the election that really counts, the general election. dionysus Dec 2016 #71

And then she got beat by Trump and his Bros in the electoral college where it counts Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #81

+1...nt SidDithers Dec 2016 #5

Really? Crunchy Frog Dec 2016 #23

True WhiteTara Dec 2016 #26

The candidate just lost the election to Donald Trump. Kentonio Dec 2016 #171

Well, if you discount FBI, Russian hackers, WhiteTara Dec 2016 #190

We lost to Donald Trump for gods sake! Kentonio Dec 2016 #192

Okay. How would you solve this WhiteTara Dec 2016 #194

A few steps to get us started.. Kentonio Dec 2016 #195

Good ideas WhiteTara Dec 2016 #196

Number 2, the platform. Kentonio Dec 2016 #197

How do you plan to acheive your goals? WhiteTara Dec 2016 #198

Hopefully by getting people to stop fighting each other and rally around a common set of goals. Kentonio Dec 2016 #199

Worthy goals, but how WhiteTara Dec 2016 #210

Thank You So Very Much Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #92

Back at you! WhiteTara Dec 2016 #131

YES! 'If this were baseball we'd be wondering what trades we need to make elleng Dec 2016 #4

+10101 golfguru Dec 2016 #33

"If we think there's nothing wrong with our strategy after just losing to a horrible jackass..." CrispyQ Dec 2016 #159

Yes indeed! elleng Dec 2016 #163

That would be awesome but so many are claiming it was the TPP and jobs bettyellen Dec 2016 #6

yup feingold and strickland did worse than Clinton JI7 Dec 2016 #12

Wrong again! KPN Dec 2016 #14

Clinton won voters concerned about economy, Trump won voters concerned about terrorism emulatorloo Dec 2016 #216

there probably won't be anymore elections. putitinD Dec 2016 #7

It's sad how divided this board and the Dems are True Dough Dec 2016 #9

Yes. Thanks. elleng Dec 2016 #10

Definitely! If dems sit and argue, then Putin and Trump are the victors now and into the RKP5637 Dec 2016 #13

I think a lot of people are in the middle realmirage Dec 2016 #11

No new message will cure the problem unless... golfguru Dec 2016 #44

So trump officially snagged the Orange Man (tm) crown from boehner? dionysus Dec 2016 #77

To my eyes, Boehner was color of over-ripe tomato going bad golfguru Dec 2016 #114

those 94 million Americans who think they reached the end of the road elmac Dec 2016 #89

That is correct UNLESS....the orange man golfguru Dec 2016 #110

I agree wholeheartedly realmirage Dec 2016 #183

Orange man conflated trade balance with trade policy all year.. JHan Dec 2016 #123

I do not think you are anywhere near the truth golfguru Dec 2016 #132

I am very much speaking the truth. JHan Dec 2016 #135

You simply can not ignore the direct linkage golfguru Dec 2016 #138

but I never denied outsourcing. JHan Dec 2016 #143

You are under a basic mis-conception that robots will take over golfguru Dec 2016 #146

How many millions of jobs are we going to pretend didn't disappear? JHan Dec 2016 #153

A lot of Democrats are automation deniers. immoderate Dec 2016 #185

Stop saying technology is to blame for lost jobs realmirage Dec 2016 #205

lol, no I won't stop saying it..You did share a great link and the study looks interesting but.. JHan Dec 2016 #211

Sadly, i think returning focus to the middle class IS a major overhaul these days... dionysus Dec 2016 #74

The Democrats need to remember the middle class realmirage Dec 2016 #184

Hillary WAS the middle NCDem777 Dec 2016 #217

Exactly! But there's a cohort here that KPN Dec 2016 #19

Exactly, why is FDR a bad word here? FDR is who we are realmirage Dec 2016 #186

FDR is not a "bad word" here. Total strawman. emulatorloo Dec 2016 #206

I don't understand the people that think nothing has to change. Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #35

You'd think that was common sense. Apparently not for many realmirage Dec 2016 #187

Yup. This Arazi Dec 2016 #57

Even if cheating was exposed though, it doesn't mean our dionysus Dec 2016 #73

I agree, we need to do both. OnionPatch Dec 2016 #117

Logically there's no middle ground to hacking, this post on its face makes little sense IMHO uponit7771 Dec 2016 #118

We need to abandon the lie that those manufacturing jobs can come back to the rust belt. LonePirate Dec 2016 #18

The links you posted are filled with bad science realmirage Dec 2016 #22

THIS!!!! KPN Dec 2016 #27

You're the one being conned if you don't know the difference between good science and bad science. LonePirate Dec 2016 #28

You didn't read the link n my OP did you? realmirage Dec 2016 #30

I read it and dismissed it because of the numerous gaping holes in it. LonePirate Dec 2016 #39

Your response indicates you need to look again realmirage Dec 2016 #46

You do understand that mechanization is more than just robots, don't you? Because the Squinch Dec 2016 #208

Yup. sfwriter Dec 2016 #31

Who the hell here is saying those jobs are coming back? KPN Dec 2016 #24

This is EXACTLY right realmirage Dec 2016 #29

"all those sources are wrong" does not address any of the points in the links provided by L. Pirate JHan Dec 2016 #32

Read #44 golfguru Dec 2016 #45

Every ESTABLISHMENT, INCUMBENT, republican won against the Democrats running for Senate in those still_one Dec 2016 #20

++++++++ I agree. skylucy Dec 2016 #34

How will we turn it around sarisataka Dec 2016 #53

Excellent post. LenaBaby61 Dec 2016 #84

"In Wisconsin, Russ Feingold lost by a greater percentage than Hillary. Wisconsin reelected Scott Cha Dec 2016 #141

+1 betsuni Dec 2016 #148

Well said. If we are going to improve our party we need to be fact-based emulatorloo Dec 2016 #207

"If this were baseball..." oasis Dec 2016 #21

The ones who want to win ARE putting the team first realmirage Dec 2016 #25

When a player joins a team he's required to listen to the leadership. oasis Dec 2016 #49

Ask the biggest losers in baseball if they're "team players" realmirage Dec 2016 #51

Democrats needed everyone on board to win. Didn't have it. oasis Dec 2016 #61

The leaders we have now aren't getting the job done. realmirage Dec 2016 #63

Again: Team play is they key to success. nt oasis Dec 2016 #66

So you'd keep a manager that kept losing? realmirage Dec 2016 #69

Nah, let's keep going down the same road. TheCowsCameHome Dec 2016 #36

Those who want the Party to change look at our losses and ask why? jalan48 Dec 2016 #37

Does that explain why Russ Feingold and Zypher Teachout lost? Does that explain why every still_one Dec 2016 #40

Those in power never want change realmirage Dec 2016 #41

People were looking for change... kentuck Dec 2016 #38

And we'd better have the right message by then realmirage Dec 2016 #42

That doesn't hold water when every establishment, republican, incumbent, won against those still_one Dec 2016 #43

Unless they voted down ticket. kentuck Dec 2016 #100

I wasn't referring to the trump supporters. I was referring to the self-identified progressives who still_one Dec 2016 #122

Lessons Learned Pabz Dec 2016 #47

Can you be less cryptic and more direct realmirage Dec 2016 #50

She has 3 million votes MFM008 Dec 2016 #55

It doesn't matter. Pabz Dec 2016 #58

Oh no MFM008 Dec 2016 #76

Really? Why did Russ Feingold and Zyper Teachout Lose? Why did every swing state Democrat running still_one Dec 2016 #78

Every Senate race voted the same as President. Hassan and Hillary both won NH by a hair. jfern Dec 2016 #209

That is where the narriative breaks down. Those that won the Senate races in still_one Dec 2016 #212

2 Minnesota members of congress who endorsed Bernie won in heavily Trump districts jfern Dec 2016 #214

I was primarily talking about the Senate races in the swing states. The still_one Dec 2016 #215

Tell us the "story", or continue to cower behind implication LanternWaste Dec 2016 #162

Cleveland Indians scored more runs than Chicago Cubs in WS golfguru Dec 2016 #213

What defeat? sarisataka Dec 2016 #48

"Saddest of all" realmirage Dec 2016 #54

I keep saying that & i get accused of not taking things "seriously" 7962 Dec 2016 #104

I really don't want us to become Alex Jones realmirage Dec 2016 #105

"If you hate somethin, don't you do it too?" E. Vedder. dionysus Dec 2016 #79

I will not just lay down MFM008 Dec 2016 #52

As long as we use the electoral college, than yes, we lost. dionysus Dec 2016 #82

I cant help it if YOU werent inspired MFM008 Dec 2016 #147

You're confusing me with a trump voter, for some reason. dionysus Dec 2016 #150

I fear we are wasting valuable time paying attention to concern trolls, too. Just sayin'... n/t TygrBright Dec 2016 #59

Address the OP and quit trolling realmirage Dec 2016 #64

LOL bravenak Dec 2016 #67

Who are you calling a troll? sheshe2 Dec 2016 #125

I'm calling a troll the person who came into my thread and insulted me. That's a troll. realmirage Dec 2016 #126

Ouch. sheshe2 Dec 2016 #133

Unbelievable. Kentonio Dec 2016 #172

Exactly. Thanks kentonio. Hypocrites are everywhere these days realmirage Dec 2016 #191

I don't need your permission to stand up for myself realmirage Dec 2016 #193

So you know, the person was insinuating that my OP was concern trolling. Hence, my response realmirage Dec 2016 #130

I just answered your last response, I am done. sheshe2 Dec 2016 #134

I second this! bravenak Dec 2016 #68

Yes, I'm concerned that we lost because I prefer winning to losing. Perhaps you don't realmirage Dec 2016 #72

Yes yes yes. I know. The team that gets three million more votes loses. The team that does not wins. bravenak Dec 2016 #75

You can win in a fantasy election, and lose in the real election realmirage Dec 2016 #87

Ok. So who are you willing to lose to get those rural voters? bravenak Dec 2016 #102

We don't have to lose anybody! We strengthen our economic message to the middle class realmirage Dec 2016 #108

They believe that blacks are taking their jobs. That offends me. bravenak Dec 2016 #113

Hmmm sheshe2 Dec 2016 #127

Well, damn! bravenak Dec 2016 #129

Would you be kind enough to point out in that article who exactly it is who believes that? Kentonio Dec 2016 #173

Google it. I did and I found many people saying it on actual video bravenak Dec 2016 #178

Many people? Enought to account for the entire Trump and non-voting groups? Kentonio Dec 2016 #189

You see what happens when you try to take away the excuses. HassleCat Dec 2016 #60

Exactly. You'd think losing was painful enough to motivate realmirage Dec 2016 #65

Superb post. dionysus Dec 2016 #70

Those jobs are not coming back. joshcryer Dec 2016 #80

Check out.... zentrum Dec 2016 #83

Hopefully the next chair can clean up the DNC madville Dec 2016 #85

Orange Hitler claimed it was rigged treestar Dec 2016 #86

And they found something other than the usual errors? No? They proved it was rigged? No? realmirage Dec 2016 #98

It was worth investigating treestar Dec 2016 #99

an investigation is not proof of anything realmirage Dec 2016 #103

well it does show there is SOME evidence treestar Dec 2016 #106

Um, try yes. The Russians actually did interfere. As well as Comey. kcr Dec 2016 #156

First post in 2 years crazycatlady Dec 2016 #88

Totally agree with you, great points realmirage Dec 2016 #91

I like this list and I'll add to it. phylny Dec 2016 #124

I'll also ad spend more money on digital advertising crazycatlady Dec 2016 #128

Agreed Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #90

Glad to hear I'm not the only one realmirage Dec 2016 #95

My Pleasure Sherman A1 Dec 2016 #151

Agree 100%!!! I am sick and tired of excuses... Yurovsky Dec 2016 #93

"Losers make excuses. Winners assume power. I'll be damned if I'm going to be a victim." realmirage Dec 2016 #94

Trump scandals ineffective but one letter from Comey + a trickle of hacked/doctored emails.... CousinIT Dec 2016 #96

So how did a guy with so many flaws beat us? realmirage Dec 2016 #101

A Twitter thread has some clues. (a lot actually) CousinIT Dec 2016 #115

Since when do we blame the victims of a crime for the actions of the criminals? baldguy Dec 2016 #97

How is the messaging not a problem? Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #144

"She wouldn't have been raped if only she hadn't been wearing that short skirt!" baldguy Dec 2016 #152

It's Management's fault shadowmayor Dec 2016 #107

Donald Trump is an ass....check. democrank Dec 2016 #109

I really agree- and we have a great chance to turn this around, if we can accept Yo_Mama Dec 2016 #111

Exactly - he won by using OUR OLD ECONOMIC PLATFORM realmirage Dec 2016 #119

Working Class Woman Will Rejoin the Party McKim Dec 2016 #112

This is exactly right realmirage Dec 2016 #120

If we go back to 1980, Democrats have lost 11 out of the 19 elections. Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #116

I actually hear people telling me loyalty is more important than principle. It's insane realmirage Dec 2016 #121

Party over principle. Orwell would be proud to hear that shit. Feeling the Bern Dec 2016 #139

Doubling down on "deplorables" won't work any better than it did the first time BRToldschool Dec 2016 #136

Bringing in Brock and his band of internet trolls azmom Dec 2016 #140

You analyze but Democrats don't? taught_me_patience Dec 2016 #142

Oh here we go with the handwringing The Liberal Lion Dec 2016 #145

It's no secret what ails the party - the party needs to expand its appeal outside of the big cities Midwestern Democrat Dec 2016 #149

Agreed entirely, but too many seem to think anything un-city doesn't matter BRToldschool Dec 2016 #155

There are those in the The "un-city" ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #157

100% agreed hellofromreddit Dec 2016 #154

So, you want us to be better liars that Trump? Adrahil Dec 2016 #160

It can be difficult to see the difference between the analysis of after-action-reports and a "refusa LanternWaste Dec 2016 #161

K&R.. disillusioned73 Dec 2016 #164

Agree deist99 Dec 2016 #165

People should shut up about the electoral college. It's not going anywhere realmirage Dec 2016 #179

Thank you for your courage... NeoConsSuck Dec 2016 #166

Right on. Glad I'm not alone realmirage Dec 2016 #174

C-level types are destroying our country, so don't expect them to give a fuck. Rex Dec 2016 #167

The Party will have to change despite them. Or the next loss will wake them up realmirage Dec 2016 #175

I agree... Joe941 Dec 2016 #168

It would help me get over the loss if I felt more hopeful about realmirage Dec 2016 #176

I think I just need to stay off the 2016 board. Ace Rothstein Dec 2016 #182

I take long breaks and have started using the ignore button again realmirage Dec 2016 #188

Some DUers enjoy defeat IronLionZion Dec 2016 #169

I dared to point out that I don't have health insurance realmirage Dec 2016 #177

Do you live in a state that expanded Medicaid? IronLionZion Dec 2016 #181

Excellent thread, very much agree. Kentonio Dec 2016 #170

This thread reminds me of the old Spy magazine feature "Logrolling in our Time". lapucelle Dec 2016 #180

The best one is the determination to jettison the rural white males. HassleCat Dec 2016 #202

That one drives me batshit realmirage Dec 2016 #203