Atheists & Agnostics

trotsky

(49,533 posts)

41. Here's a related one to ponder.

Mon Dec 21, 2015, 01:30 PM

Dec 2015

Do people have free will in heaven?

Supposedly, "free will" is such an awesome, important thing that we have to allow for people murdering and raping each other and disease and everything bad in the world just so we can have it.

But heaven is free from all those bad things, presumably. Otherwise we'd just call it "the other Earth you go to after you die here." So either:

1) It's possible to have free will without anyone suffering. The whole foundation of Christian theology is a lie.

or

2) People don't have free will in heaven. But since free will is the most important gift god gave us, how much of a paradise can heaven be if we aren't free to do what we want?

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

80 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

If God knows everything, then we do not have free will. Why does he create people [View all] JRLeft Dec 2015 OP

He created people because he needs money in the collection basket. Hoppy Dec 2015 #1

I've always wanted to know why he needs so much money. JRLeft Dec 2015 #2

COMPLEX THEOLOGY!!!!1!!!!! uriel1972 Dec 2015 #3

Why does he create a guessing environment, either pick the right religion or go to hell. JRLeft Dec 2015 #6

If I were god and could make the laws of physics be anything at all... Binkie The Clown Dec 2015 #4

If God was nice he would have made earth a paradise and allowed people to JRLeft Dec 2015 #5

But he did whatthehey Dec 2015 #40

There's a Grand Plan, ours is not to question, mysterious ways, blah de freakin' blah ... Arugula Latte Dec 2015 #7

Gawd I hate that answer, God killed my kid I guess it's all part of God's plan. JRLeft Dec 2015 #8

Yep, such bullshit. And then there are those who say things like Arugula Latte Dec 2015 #9

Yep, I always ask people about innocent baby deaths, and their response is JRLeft Dec 2015 #10

There's Biblical support for that idea. Mariana Dec 2015 #43

How sick of God do such a vile thing. JRLeft Dec 2015 #45

That particular god has done a lot of vile things Mariana Dec 2015 #47

That makes 2 of us. JRLeft Dec 2015 #49

The unforgivable sin is not believing in God. If you don't believe, you can't ask forgiveness. CrispyQ Dec 2015 #79

Yeah like when I was 10 and someone said mountain grammy Dec 2015 #24

Why does God need anyone, he can do whatever he wants right? JRLeft Dec 2015 #28

My mother died on thanksgiving day 1981 awoke_in_2003 Dec 2015 #54

That's because no one actually reads the bible, and if they fid I believe most would become JRLeft Dec 2015 #59

"Mysterious" means "This is nonsense, but I don't want to admit that even to myself." n/t Binkie The Clown Dec 2015 #33

You there are a lot of people who have doubt, but choose to JRLeft Dec 2015 #37

Great questions. Curmudgeoness Dec 2015 #11

The creators of religion have done mankind a huge disservice. JRLeft Dec 2015 #12

No shit! nt Curmudgeoness Dec 2015 #13

Religion is a plague on the planet, the sooner it is eradicated the better. JRLeft Dec 2015 #14

Good luck with that. Curmudgeoness Dec 2015 #15

That rationale still exists. If I can't explain, only God can. JRLeft Dec 2015 #16

Not necessarily Warpy Dec 2015 #36

Great questions. I got nothing. AlbertCat Dec 2015 #18

Agreed. JRLeft Dec 2015 #21

Read up on child abuse and it reveals a lot about religion. Freelancer Dec 2015 #17

Think of God as an old surfing instructor AlbertCat Dec 2015 #19

LOL. Think of it as Chewbacca, or Jiminy Cricket if you like... Freelancer Dec 2015 #31

I've heard the battered wife analogy. JRLeft Dec 2015 #23

I've seen that expressed another way. onager Dec 2015 #42

That's the best one yet. JRLeft Dec 2015 #50

That's a good one. I'll use that someday. -- nt Freelancer Dec 2015 #53

Perfect. nt awoke_in_2003 Dec 2015 #55

That's a fascinating comparison. trotsky Dec 2015 #62

Here's another good question.... AlbertCat Dec 2015 #20

Maybe God was bored? JRLeft Dec 2015 #22

Yes, and why wait 14 billion + years Arugula Latte Dec 2015 #25

When we anti-theists make sense, theists get frustrated and JRLeft Dec 2015 #29

Maybe the closest thing to what we've called God is the living part of the Earth Freelancer Dec 2015 #32

Yep we are still evolving. JRLeft Dec 2015 #38

"We're stooges for Jehova, he loves to knock us over" arcane1 Dec 2015 #26

"As flies to wanton boys are we to th' gods. They kill us for their sport." Arugula Latte Dec 2015 #35

Epicurus once asked the same things: beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #27

^ right JRLeft Dec 2015 #30

None of the above, because... NeoGreen Dec 2015 #34

Exactly! JRLeft Dec 2015 #39

Here's a related one to ponder. trotsky Dec 2015 #41

I thought some Sophisticated Theology might help. onager Dec 2015 #44

It has been said that one of the great pleasures of Heaven Mariana Dec 2015 #48

Watch people suffer like it's a TV show for God's enjoyment. JRLeft Dec 2015 #51

Yup, I have met several of those kinds of Christians. trotsky Dec 2015 #63

Can you explain to me how, Jesus freaks cannot see how immoral their God is? JRLeft Dec 2015 #65

It is all part of the "humans cannot comprehend the mind of god" nonsense. trotsky Dec 2015 #66

Turn a blind eye to the evil shit, in order to accept the religion as a whole. JRLeft Dec 2015 #71

The ones who thinks it's fine and dandy now Mariana Dec 2015 #72

Well they think it's find and dandy, because their fiction book JRLeft Dec 2015 #74

Won't they all be surprised when they wake up on Riverworld! CrispyQ Dec 2015 #80

The SyFy channel just did a series based on edhopper Dec 2015 #46

Sounds more realistic. JRLeft Dec 2015 #52

I liked it OriginalGeek Dec 2015 #69

I usually piss off weird believers when I tell them. "When this God stops somebody from.. BlueJazz Dec 2015 #56

You're moral compass is far superior to their God's. JRLeft Dec 2015 #57

I like it. Iggo Dec 2015 #68

Mysterious ways. DetlefK Dec 2015 #58

The Bible was written by primitive men. JRLeft Dec 2015 #60

The Argument from Free Will is as insipid as it is stupid. Act_of_Reparation Dec 2015 #61

God was created by time traveling atheists sent back to save the future. Freelancer Dec 2015 #73

LMFAO! JRLeft Dec 2015 #75

Glad somebody read it, and had a little fun. Thanks! -- nt Freelancer Dec 2015 #77

That was hilarious, but it also shows how absurd the whole idea of religion is. JRLeft Dec 2015 #78

You're asking the wrong people. mr blur Dec 2015 #64

And here's the perfect soundtrack for that visit... onager Dec 2015 #70

To.Fuck.With.Us. Iggo Dec 2015 #67

If you ask a theist he does indeed exist, the Bible is proof. JRLeft Dec 2015 #76