Welcome to DU!
The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards.
Join the community:
Create a free account
Support DU (and get rid of ads!):
Become a Star Member
Latest Breaking News
Editorials & Other Articles
General Discussion
The DU Lounge
All Forums
Issue Forums
Culture Forums
Alliance Forums
Region Forums
Support Forums
Help & Search
Gun Control & RKBA
In reply to the discussion: The second amendment is irrelevant- [View all]gejohnston
(17,502 posts)110. it really doesn't
both sides claim Miller as a victory as their side. One problem was that Miller's council was not there. The only thing your quote says is that there was no evidence shown to the court that such a shotgun had any military value, not a protected weapon. In other words, if it were an unregistered BAR or Thompson SMG, the decision may have been different.
Gun control advocates point out that for over six decades the United States Circuit Courts, with very few exceptions, point to the precedence of the Miller case while rejecting legal challenges to federal firearm regulations.[5]
Gun rights advocates claim this case as a victory because they interpret it to state that ownership of weapons for efficiency or preservation of a well-regulated militia unit of the present day is specifically protected. Furthermore, they frequently point out that short-barreled shotguns have been commonly used in warfare, and the statement made by the judges indicates that they were not made aware of this.[6] Because the defense did not appear, there was arguably no way for the judges to know otherwise. Two of the justices involved in the decision had prior military experience, Justice Black as a Captain in the field artillery during WWI and Justice Frankfurter as a Major in the Army legal service; however, there is no way to know if they were personally aware of the use of shotguns by American troops. During WWI, between 30,000 and 40,000 short-barreled pump-action shotguns were purchased by the US Ordnance Department and saw service in the trenches and for guarding German prisoners
Gun rights advocates claim this case as a victory because they interpret it to state that ownership of weapons for efficiency or preservation of a well-regulated militia unit of the present day is specifically protected. Furthermore, they frequently point out that short-barreled shotguns have been commonly used in warfare, and the statement made by the judges indicates that they were not made aware of this.[6] Because the defense did not appear, there was arguably no way for the judges to know otherwise. Two of the justices involved in the decision had prior military experience, Justice Black as a Captain in the field artillery during WWI and Justice Frankfurter as a Major in the Army legal service; however, there is no way to know if they were personally aware of the use of shotguns by American troops. During WWI, between 30,000 and 40,000 short-barreled pump-action shotguns were purchased by the US Ordnance Department and saw service in the trenches and for guarding German prisoners
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Miller
So why didn't NFA ban such shotguns and machine guns?
The purpose of the NFA[1] was to regulate what were considered "gangster weapons" such as machine guns and short barreled shotguns.[2] Then U.S. Attorney General Homer S. Cummings recognized that firearms could not be banned outright under the Second Amendment, so he proposed restrictive regulation in the form of an expensive tax and Federal registration.[citation needed] Originally, pistols and revolvers were to be regulated as strictly as machine guns; towards that end, cutting down a rifle or shotgun to circumvent the handgun restrictions by making a concealable weapon was taxed as strictly as a machine gun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act
Edit history
Please sign in to view edit histories.
Recommendations
0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):
145 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
RecommendedHighlight replies with 5 or more recommendations
There is no way to construe that through grammar, history or legal precedent.
PavePusher
Sep 2012
#129
How did we get to the point were we are at today? How did we get to the place where gunners
upaloopa
Sep 2012
#10
What is an opinion? Is it just some thought like a wisp that floats around in the air and has no
upaloopa
Sep 2012
#27
I think I understand were you are coming from. I respect your right to your opinion and your
upaloopa
Sep 2012
#43
I feel that the gun lobby is not rational. Instead of gun nut I could say irrational gun people.
upaloopa
Sep 2012
#52
That is complete bullshit. You don't hear from the majority because they don't make
upaloopa
Sep 2012
#85
Wrong 2A is there to protect us against a standing army. Reread your history books.
Peepsite
Sep 2012
#12
that's easy: for you, any change to current regulations are not reasonable unless
Warren Stupidity
Sep 2012
#101
can you show me one statement of you supporting any proposed new regulation?
Warren Stupidity
Sep 2012
#108
We are in a very different position today and have every defensive implement that
digonswine
Sep 2012
#72
That takes care of the 6 million NRA members - what about the 50 million non-NRA gun owners?
hack89
Sep 2012
#46
How do you propose to convince 1/4 of the population that they are perverts?
friendly_iconoclast
Sep 2012
#143
I think he Shares our almost United opinion that Loudly once went by another name here...
friendly_iconoclast
Sep 2012
#136
The right to own, say, and do anything is assumed. All rights exist until they are restricted...
slackmaster
Sep 2012
#90
Well no, if you read the history it was originally all about local militias
Warren Stupidity
Sep 2012
#79
It does not matter if the second amendment is obsolete or not. It is LAW.
Atypical Liberal
Sep 2012
#87
Cool straw man, bro. The presence of firearms is clearly what makes Somalia so dangerous. nt
rDigital
Sep 2012
#119
"It applies only to a standing militia..." Well, no, actually; it applies to the people.
PavePusher
Sep 2012
#128