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Ghost in the Machine

(14,912 posts)
17. Too many people misinterpret the 2nd Amendment *because* of the "well regulated militia" term...
Sat Mar 26, 2016, 05:09 AM
Mar 2016

What they DON'T understand is that before the Revolutionary War, we didn't have a regular Standing Army. We did, however, AFTER the Revolutionary War. Our forefathers had the insight to keep the PEOPLE armed, to protect themselves and be able to fight back in case someone tried to take over the Government in an armed military coup.

Here is the amendment as ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, then-Secretary of State:

"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."



Here is some history on the military:

Though its roots date back to the Continental Army of the Revolutionary War, the U.S. military did not officially get its start until September 29, 1789, when Congress passed a bill legalizing the small contingent already in uniform. Two hundred twenty-five years later, gets the facts on what’s become the world’s most powerful fighting force.


1
At the beginning, the military was practically nonexistent.

Believing that “standing armies in time of peace are inconsistent with the principles of republican governments [and] dangerous to the liberties of a free people,” the U.S. legislature disbanded the Continental Army following the Revolutionary War, except for a few dozen troops guarding munitions at West Point, New York, and Fort Pitt, Pennsylvania. Yet it also called upon four well-manned state militias to provide 700 men in order to deal with potential threats from Native Americans and the British. A reorganized version of this so-called First American Regiment essentially would be all President George Washington had at his command upon taking office in April 1789.

2
Washington had to remind Congress to create the military.

The ratification of the Constitution in 1788 greatly expanded the federal government’s authority, in part by giving Congress the power to raise and support armies. The First Congress did not immediately act upon this provision, however, choosing instead to set up the State, War and Treasury departments and the judiciary, among other things. On August 7, 1789, President Washington urged it to establish “some uniform and effective system” for the military “on which the honor, safety and well being of our country so evidently and essentially depend.” He made a second plea for action three days later. But it was not until September 29, the last day of its first session, that Congress passed a bill empowering the president “to call into service, from time to time, such part of the militia of the states, respectively, as he may judge necessary.” Before that, states could refuse to send along their men.
http://www.history.com/news/9-things-you-may-not-know-about-the-u-s-armed-forces


As you can see, this was ratified in 1789, while the right of the people to keep and bear arms and was adopted on December 15, 1791, as part of the first ten amendments contained in the Bill of Rights.

The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms and was adopted on December 15, 1791, as part of the first ten amendments contained in the Bill of Rights.[1][2][3][4] The Supreme Court of the United States has ruled that the right belongs to individuals,[5][6] while also ruling that the right is not unlimited and does not prohibit all regulation of either firearms or similar devices.[7] State and local governments are limited to the same extent as the federal government from infringing this right per the incorporation of the Bill of Rights.

The Second Amendment was based partially on the right to keep and bear arms in English common law and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. Sir William Blackstone described this right as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state.[8]

In United States v. Cruikshank (1876), the Supreme Court of the United States ruled that, "The right to bear arms is not granted by the Constitution; neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence" and limited the applicability of the Second Amendment to the federal government.[9] In United States v. Miller (1939), the Supreme Court ruled that the federal government and the states could limit any weapon types not having a "reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well regulated militia."[10][11]

In the twenty-first century, the amendment has been subjected to renewed academic inquiry and judicial interest.[11] In District of Columbia v. Heller (2008), the Supreme Court handed down a landmark decision that held the amendment protects an individual right to possess and carry firearms.[12][13] In McDonald v. Chicago (2010), the Court clarified its earlier decisions that limited the amendment's impact to a restriction on the federal government, expressly holding that the Fourteenth Amendment applies the Second Amendment to state and local governments to the same extent that the Second Amendment applies to the federal government.[14] In Caetano v. Massachusetts (2016), the Supreme Court reiterated its earlier rulings that "the Second Amendment extends, prima facie, to all instruments that constitute bearable arms, even those that were not in existence at the time of the founding" and that its protection is not limited to "only those weapons useful in warfare".
{All emphasis mine}

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution


I STILL don't understand what is so hard to comprehend about 4 simple words... "the right of the people", especially when everyone seems to understand it when used in "We, the People".....

I see a LOT of "South Bashing" on here, saying that Democrats should "give up on the South because their only concern is GAWD & GUNS!" Get something straight here... it's NOT just the South, but EVERY PART of "Rural America", where poor, struggling families RELY ON HUNTING to put food on the table to feed their families.

It's HARD to bring these people to our side because of a small, yet VERY VOCAL, minority part of the Democratic Party is advocating banning & confiscation, leaving these people afraid that they won't be able to feed their families. They have no more desire to kill another Human Being than Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, or millions of other Democratic & Liberal gun owners do, yet they are constantly being called (paraphrasing): 'salivating "heroes" just waiting for the chance to murder someone'.

Ghost

A well regulated militia? [View all] flamin lib Mar 2016 OP
If we were to live in a fact based world randr Mar 2016 #1
Please elaborate TeddyR Mar 2016 #2
Oh... let's see... 2naSalit Mar 2016 #6
As the individual below pointed out TeddyR Mar 2016 #11
After thinking about this TeddyR Mar 2016 #12
depends on which Bundy situation gejohnston Mar 2016 #15
Blocked traffic and threatened to murder folks with their guns? stone space Mar 2016 #21
illegally occupying or blocking public use of public land gejohnston Mar 2016 #24
I'll start randr Mar 2016 #9
Human beings are flawed... CompanyFirstSergeant Mar 2016 #3
Heller clarified that the Second Amendment TeddyR Mar 2016 #4
Heller "clarified" about as much as Bowers v Hardwick "clarified". stone space Mar 2016 #22
I'm sorry you don't like the fact TeddyR Mar 2016 #25
The 2A protects an individual right hack89 Mar 2016 #5
Do you have any comment on those sarisataka Mar 2016 #7
Bran muffins JonathanRackham Mar 2016 #8
Before the 2A, there was a guarantee to life and liberty. ileus Mar 2016 #10
Your logic is more cantilevered than an old railroad bridge... Eleanors38 Mar 2016 #13
Since the 'well regulated militia' has been recreated into the jmg257 Mar 2016 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author CompanyFirstSergeant Mar 2016 #16
Too many people misinterpret the 2nd Amendment *because* of the "well regulated militia" term... Ghost in the Machine Mar 2016 #17
Nice commentary but you missed the whole point of the OP. nt flamin lib Mar 2016 #18
No, your point was to try to lump all gun owners into a "militia", which is a false analogy. n/t Ghost in the Machine Mar 2016 #20
british scholars disagreed with heller jimmy the one Mar 2016 #30
remedial history for ghosts jimmy the one Mar 2016 #31
Why do you keep citing Miller? TeddyR Mar 2016 #32
It takes a militia jimmy the one Mar 2016 #33
I'd like to see some support TeddyR Mar 2016 #37
Story's full quote, parsed jimmy the one Mar 2016 #40
Thanks TeddyR Mar 2016 #42
You do Justice Story a disservice TeddyR Mar 2016 #43
Only 1% - 6% voted unanimous for G.Washington jimmy the one Apr 2016 #46
Here's a bit, when Congress was actually discussing the article that became the 2nd amendment... jmg257 Mar 2016 #41
Once again you twist Story's words tortoise1956 Apr 2016 #45
blackstone wasn't individual 'have arms' man jimmy the one Apr 2016 #47
Seems like you are confusing the military (armies, Navy) with the militia. jmg257 Mar 2016 #35
I think you are confused about who "the PEOPLE" are... Ghost in the Machine Mar 2016 #38
The Militia was formed from the body of the people, so yes - the people had their rights jmg257 Mar 2016 #39
You seem to confuse the militia with the individuals who may nor may not be in it. ManiacJoe Mar 2016 #19
A Well-Regulated Militia stone space Mar 2016 #23
Cartoons, the last resort of a poster who has nothing original of their own to say. Lurks Often Mar 2016 #26
Post removed Post removed Mar 2016 #28
Aww, do you have a sadz? Lurks Often Mar 2016 #29
It is understandable... beevul Mar 2016 #34
That one has less self control then most Lurks Often Mar 2016 #36
Amazing how this "art/journalism" form has remained so static in this day and age. nt Eleanors38 Apr 2016 #44
Members of a Christian militia accused of plotting an antigovernment uprising were acquitted... discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2016 #27
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