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William Seger

(11,031 posts)
69. "Even if the statement in the OP were true..."
Mon Mar 18, 2013, 06:18 AM
Mar 2013

"... so what?"

Well, I don't think the point is anything like "Gary Mack believes Oswald shot JFK so you should, too" (even though we are frequently regaled with sentiments like that from the other side of the fence). There is this bit of real insight:

Two decades later, and 15 years after his immersion in conspiracy research, he realized he’d abandoned his journalistic training along the way.

“I had learned the basics — step back and look at all sides. But I’d read all the pro-conspiracy books and was convinced they were probably right,” he said. “When I decided to step back, I realized they weren’t telling me the whole story, just one side of it.”


Maybe it's a "so what" to you, but that story is something I can personally relate to. In the late '60s, I had read a couple of conspiracy theory books and like Mack, I was completely convinced that they were probably right.

Perhaps Mack's "epiphany" was also a big "so what" to you:

And then, in the early 1990s, he had a revelation.

It centered on the story of Ricky Don White, “who thought, based on everything he heard from his mother, that his father, Roscoe White, was the grassy knoll gunman,” Mack said.

But much of the story didn’t add up, said Mack, now 66. So he and Dave Perry, a former claims investigator who applied the techniques of that job in his research, went looking for answers. None of them seemed to back White’s story about his late father, a one-time Dallas police officer, said Mack, who was working for Channel 5 at the time.

“I tipped off our people at the station that this wasn’t going to end well,” he said. “A couple of weeks later, Ricky visited a class at UT-Arlington, and Dave and I went out to hear him. And afterward, we told Ricky, ‘We’ve been checking out your story and your dad didn’t do it. Aren’t you glad?’

“And he said, ‘Well, we think he did.’

“That was my epiphany, so to speak,” Mack said.


The thing that put me on the road to thinking otherwise about CTs was a comment by one skeptic (I don't remember his name) who noted that nothing the conspiracists claimed that appeared to be true was really conclusive of a conspiracy, and nothing that they claimed that would be conclusive of a conspiracy appeared to be true. When I decided to "step back" and re-examine those claims and include the counter-claims and criticisms offered by skeptics, the more I looked, the more that comment rang true.

Today, I don't claim to "know" the "truth" about the assassination, but after my own attempts to be as objective as possible, I am convinced that all the credible evidence says Oswald was the assassin and no credible evidence convincingly implicates anyone else. The difference between that and claiming to know the truth is that my conclusions are completely conditional: Even today I'm willing to consider and evaluate any new evidence (although I will admit to having shorter and shorter patience with being handed abject bullshit instead).

So here's "so what" about Mack's story for me: It's incredibly easy to get sucked in by one-sided, half-truth propaganda, which is precisely what conspiracy hucksters are selling, and once sold on a belief, that belief can become such a part of who we are that it can be very hard if not impossible to shake -- particularly after we've committed to publicly defending that belief. But I know from personal experience that it is possible, and all it takes is some of that open-mindedness that conspiracists claim to possess in such abundance.

And another "so what" for good measure: Whether or not you agree with Gary Mack's conclusions, don't shit on him and his story and then try to tell me how open-minded you are.
Thank you zappaman Mar 2013 #1
I have searched for these "conspiracy cranks " Frosty1 Mar 2013 #2
The first time I ever visited the 6th Floor Museum.. MicaelS Mar 2013 #3
The first time I visited the 6th floor museum... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #4
Again with the "ear witness" stuff William Seger Mar 2013 #5
Couple of things, Bill... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #6
Looks more like a couple of nothings, Mom William Seger Mar 2013 #7
Talk about wasting you keyboard skills... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #8
"Point me to any one of those videos..." William Seger Mar 2013 #9
Couldn't find one, huh? William Seger Mar 2013 #12
Please don't cry, Bill MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #14
No problem. William Seger Mar 2013 #18
You understand you are kicking my post about a reformed conspiracy theorist? Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #21
Whatever exposes the truth... matters not BB MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #22
Kick! n/t zappaman Mar 2013 #26
There's a PARKING LOT BEHIND THAT FENCE. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #10
Good point William Seger Mar 2013 #11
Not to mention all those people you can see looking back at the TSBD in the films used here Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #13
Enter mcadams... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #16
It's got nothing to do with McAdams William Seger Mar 2013 #17
HA! MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #15
Nah, they'd naturally decide to do a suicide rush on the shooter William Seger Mar 2013 #19
OK, fine! All those folks are bugging up there to catch them a second shooter. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #20
"That would fit the facts, woodunit? MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #23
Maybe the second shooter got beamed up, then? Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #24
Maybe you could continue to give credence to your belief... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #27
Yes, I agree that a second shooter up on the grassy knoll is silly and hilarious Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #30
You would... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #32
Feel free to explain how the second shooter got away any time now. n/t Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #33
That's the argument of the absolute... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #34
If there was a second shooter, he got away. How? Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #35
I'll bet a lot of people got away... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #36
You can't answer because there is no answer that doesn't expose you to ridicule. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #37
I can only answer real questions... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #39
How did the second shooter escape? That's a real question. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #40
Episode Six: "Jim DiEugenio discusses a strange visit..." William Seger Mar 2013 #54
You apparently make an argument... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #56
"All of this testimony strongly suggests..." William Seger Mar 2013 #57
reply to #54 arguille Mar 2013 #74
"represents quite a bit more than the 'nothing' you think it does" William Seger Mar 2013 #76
I'll take that bet. zappaman Mar 2013 #38
I was fortunate to visit it once and it immediately struck me that Oswald was a dumbass... truebrit71 Mar 2013 #25
Heck, the photo supports what you said, if nothing else. MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #28
No, the "real perps" were the dumb asses William Seger Mar 2013 #29
No, actually, they were the smart ones....Oswald DID get blamed for something he was perhaps only... truebrit71 Mar 2013 #42
You're just assuming the consequent. William Seger Mar 2013 #43
Ah, I shouldn't believe my lying eyes... truebrit71 Mar 2013 #46
Well, first, I'd suggest actually USING your eyes William Seger Mar 2013 #52
reply to #52 arguille Mar 2013 #73
Uh.... huh? William Seger Mar 2013 #75
And if he'd tried to shoot then, everyone would have seen him do it. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #31
I'm sorry but that isn't even remotely logical... truebrit71 Mar 2013 #41
Sweet Jesus. At the very least, the Secret Service would have. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #44
"At the very least, the Secret Service would have." zappaman Mar 2013 #45
He ran because he knew he was being set up... truebrit71 Mar 2013 #47
He ran because he had just assassinated the President of the United States... Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #48
...except he had done no such thing.. truebrit71 Mar 2013 #49
...except he had... Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #50
That's difficult to understand because it doesn't make any sense William Seger Mar 2013 #53
According to the OP, Gary Mack "now believes Oswald was the only gunman that day." AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #51
Yes, that is correct. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #55
Re-read what was posted at #51, not your interpretation of the story referred to in the OP. AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #58
I'm sorry, but it's you that has the problem with reading comprehension. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #59
No. Your problem is that (a) you came up with a who-gives-a-shit story, (b) you interpreted what AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #60
Thank you for your concern. n/t Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #61
That's what you can expect, AM... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #62
Have we a bet yet? zappaman Mar 2013 #64
What does that tell me? In my experience, liberals are open minded, are willing to consider facts, AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #65
To ignore a mockingbird... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #66
Is this yet one more snide DU-rule-skating insinuation that I am not a liberal and in league with Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #67
+1 zappaman Mar 2013 #68
Gary Mack... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #63
"Even if the statement in the OP were true..." William Seger Mar 2013 #69
It is enough that you misrepresent what I've said. You've changed the subject. AnotherMcIntosh Mar 2013 #70
Well, that particular comment was really addressed to... William Seger Mar 2013 #71
Oh, by the way, I see now that you are correct William Seger Mar 2013 #72
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