So, What Are the Facts that 'Prove' Ohio '04 was a Rigged Election?

[truedelphi]

24. Also look at the "Carville Effect"

I have posted this many times on DU - it is the morning after the Nov 2004 Presidential election.

James Carville is whispering into John Kerry's ear, that in regards to Ohio, Kerry should concede. Kerry is misinformed: he is told that there are only 250,000 ballots in dispute that could possibly be counted to overthrow Bush's 138,000 ballot lead.

What those of us who hate Carville for this know are the following salient points:
One) there were other matters above and beyond the 250,000 ballots.
Those matters include the suppression of the vote by not allowing enough election machines into heavily Democratic areas, while keeping the Republican districts supplied with surplus of machinery.
The outright flipping of votes: see the most excellent film "Stealing America- vote by vote", by Dorothy Faddiman
The wrongful tallying of votes - as when several dozen districts had more Bush voters than actual registered voters

Two) The lock down inside Warren County's vote counting headquarters, by official Young of the local Emergency Services. Young was claiming that Homeland Security said that there was a threat. After Kerry's concession, it came out that Homeland Security had not ruled that there was a terrorist threat. Nor had the FBI CIA or any other security agency. Kerry should not have conceded at least until charges were levied against Mr. Young. Other wise it sets the stage for any voting official who desires that the vote be counted in secret use this action as a precedent.

(Currently, as the National Election guidelines and state guidelines are written, any person(s) who wish to watch the vote count at their local Registrar of Voters office may do so, simply by letting the local ROV know of their intention ahead of time. Failure of the ROV to comply carries legal penalties. Contact yr local County District Attorney if you are denied this right.
Three) Voting activists in Ohio now believe that at the time that Kerry conceded - there were about 400,000 ballots that could have entered into a contested election scenario. Those 400,000 ballots would be more than enough ballots to defeat Bush's lead, especially considering that many of these were provisional ballots - and provisionals are usually from poorer minority voters.

The fact that Kerry conceded sets up an incredibly painful precedent. It shows us that whenever an election is won by illegal means, there is no point in fighting to establish the wrongfulness of said election: after all, Kerry "did the right thing for the country while we were at war."

The fact that Carville was acting, perhaps as much on Clinton's behalf as his own behalf, to secure for her the chance to run in 2008, indicates to me that Clinton is not out for this country but for her own self interests.


Here is a portion of an article which can be read in entirety at

http://tinyurl.com/yrfaqo


Did Carville and Joe Lockhart Sell Kerry Out?



Woodward's book lays it out pretty plainly. No one should be surprised.

One important point, however, is that people have started talking about the Carville - Matalin angle, but everyone stops there. If you read a bit further Mike McCurry comes into the picture. It seals the deal.

Here's a story not in the Woodward book. According to one person I talked to today, who spoke on condition of anonymity, Joe Lockhart, in the middle of a heated presidential campaign, started making new business calls out of the Kerry war room giving out confidential campaign information while he was at it. Obviously trying to hedge his bets, he'd call out, give poll data and other info to people, while trying to drum up business for himself. Class act.

Frankly, it reminds me of what McCurry did on the Net Neutrality stuff.

For DC Democrats it's all about keeping your candidates close, but your business associates and their interests closer.

As for what's said in the Woodward book, one Kerry camp insider I talked to today certainly wasn't surprised by the revelations.


"The fact that the Clintonistas did not truly have JK's best interest at heart in 2004 comes as no surprise to anyone deeply involved in the Kerry camp." - Kerry insider, who would not go on the record.

At some point it got out of control.

The DC Dems hired to fight for John Kerry simply sold him out at the first sign of a fight. Except for a loyal group closest to Kerry, many of the people in his employ simply sucked. I can't say it any plainer. Woodward offers more proof on what's been speculated about for a couple of years now.

But did Carville and McCurry really sell Kerry out? Playing stenographer, because this is important, I offer the whole picture, which goes way beyond Carville. It points to the reality that if our presidential candidate is going to win he or she has to extricate themselves from these self-interested traitors inside our own party who are willing to sell out the Democratic Party cause, which must be to fight and win elections, in support of their own interests.

It's important to hammer this scene out because we are facing a critical election in just a few weeks. Every single candidate must be prepared to stand up and fight back, because it takes more than just counting the vote against Republicans these days. As an aside, if you can vote through absentee ballot, which offers a paper trail that electronic voting does not, do it.

But when the end isn't certain there is only one thing to do: declare victory and fight it out.

It's clear Carville and McCurry had their eyes on something else entirely. With Democrats like Carville and McCurry helping us out on election night we hardly need Karl Rove.


After 1 a.m., Card called Cahill.

Cahill said the Kerry campaign felt confident.

Card was caught off guard. ... --Is there going to be a phone call?"

"We won't be calling you," Cahill replied. She seemed to be half asking whether Bush would be calling Kerry to concede.

(snip)

Matalin is married to James Carville, a Democrat who had been chief political strategist for Bill Clinton in 1992. ... ...

"Look, I know this is hard for you," she told him sympathetically.
Did Carville and Joe Lockhart, and McCurry Sell Kerry Out?



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