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spin

(17,493 posts)

231. It's hard to convince people that you are right on the issues and they are wrong...

Tue Dec 6, 2016, 09:10 PM

Dec 2016

if you look at them as "dumb ignorant shit-kickers worth only of contempt" unless you are damn good at acting. Hillary never managed to convince voters in the rural areas that she actually understood their problems. Hell, she even labeled half of the Trunp supports as "deplorable" and some "irredeemable."

Admittedly she did have somewhat of a point however she managed to fire up a high percentage of Trump supporters and convince them to show up at the polls and vote for Trump.

There are plenty of reasons to help explain the odd result of this election and one of them is simply the fact that Hillary is simply not a very charismatic candidate. In today's world the most qualified and capable candidate can easily lose an election to someone far less qualified if they lack the ability to dazzle their supporters.

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So: What do we do about the fact that small-town and rural Americans are so out of touch [View all] Recursion Nov 2016 OP

Since when are small-town and rural people not "ordinary Americans"? The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #1

They're about 20% of the country. That's not "ordinary" Recursion Nov 2016 #3

Agriculture in those areas provides cheap food for the rest of us. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #11

Thank you. nt cwydro Nov 2016 #70

They also get cheap insurance. No more direct subsidies but JimBeard Nov 2016 #73

With illegal immigrant labor treestar Nov 2016 #76

... handmade34 Nov 2016 #96

Ahhh . . . don't agribusinesses produce most of the food for the country now? brush Nov 2016 #130

Yes the family farms are huge and use government subsidized insurance. JimBeard Nov 2016 #145

LOL...yeah, the other 4/5 will be eating each others refuse, eh? pipoman Nov 2016 #27

I hope you are not saying that because you live in a large urban center you are ... spin Nov 2016 #61

Sounds like that mchill Dec 2016 #226

about 28% hfojvt Nov 2016 #68

I think it is 21 percent rural and small town, 29.9 percent urban, and 49.1 percent StevieM Dec 2016 #241

As a rural resident, I consider myself delightfully abnormal then. Kilgore Nov 2016 #102

What a remarkably foolish and short-sighted statement. 11 Bravo Dec 2016 #221

the only way you will get rural America is to remove reproductive rights from our platform Horse with no Name Nov 2016 #8

My daughter is in Texas in the military marlakay Nov 2016 #44

By which of course they mean the WHITE babies Maru Kitteh Nov 2016 #56

Don't forget to dump the idea to pass new gun bans and limits on the number... spin Nov 2016 #63

Too bad really CountAllVotes Nov 2016 #127

You are absoluely, 100% correct! Thank you! hamsterjill Nov 2016 #140

The problem is, calling them "ordinary Americans" implies the other 80% are not "ordinary Americans" Iggo Nov 2016 #126

The point is that the knee jerk reaction is to consider them to be the definition of "ordinary Squinch Dec 2016 #193

Well... We could start... FBaggins Nov 2016 #2

Not really. 1 in 5 is pretty unusual Recursion Nov 2016 #5

They are not weird or unusual. That's incredibly insulting and condescending The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #14

It's not insulting to point out it's a small segment of the population Recursion Nov 2016 #17

Your comment wasn't just that rural people represent a small percentage The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #26

1 in 5 is certainly "unusual"; you have to grant that Recursion Nov 2016 #28

Hey Recursion, just very slowly, easy now, gently, pangaia Nov 2016 #58

Homosexuals constitute 5% of the population. TupperHappy Nov 2016 #143

Ok then while we're discussing percentages 14% of the population is considered black. bluesbassman Nov 2016 #156

What about the highly educated? neeksgeek Dec 2016 #190

But they don't do it anymore. The NFO was one of the most radical and I supported them but JimBeard Nov 2016 #146

Unfortunately this is true. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #151

Very true Duckhunter935 Nov 2016 #85

"Small town and rural" is larger than 20% FBaggins Nov 2016 #19

I mean, it's about 22% Recursion Nov 2016 #21

Populations under 25,000 were about half of the country just a few years ago FBaggins Nov 2016 #23

No, sorry: I'm done with coddling small towns. They are not "ordinary": I am Recursion Nov 2016 #31

"Cut them off"? The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #34

I have a farm bill for that. Recursion Nov 2016 #36

If people don't vote the way you like sarisataka Nov 2016 #40

My answer? Not at all. That is * their * answer Recursion Nov 2016 #42

In post #31 you stated sarisataka Nov 2016 #47

I have been in farming all my life and have seen small farms getting larger and JimBeard Nov 2016 #74

I have heard that all my life and have farmed. There is always someone JimBeard Nov 2016 #75

Rural communities also support lumber production, recreation for urbanites (skiing, rock climbing... mchill Dec 2016 #227

They are not "ordinary": I am tecelote Nov 2016 #83

The you can add ignorant to biggoted FBaggins Nov 2016 #92

I'm With You Baggins ProfessorGAC Nov 2016 #94

Wow I woud live there any day rather than some crowded urban shit hole nt doc03 Dec 2016 #183

You know how I test if a post has no content? metalbot Dec 2016 #185

WTF? pipi_k Dec 2016 #210

I'm with Recursion on this one. Aristus Nov 2016 #124

I hear black people really like them collards too... right? FBaggins Nov 2016 #125

I am part of the solution. Aristus Nov 2016 #128

Did you note the context of what you were replying to? FBaggins Nov 2016 #132

He said he wants to "cut them off" - Cut off Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid to them. Aristus Nov 2016 #152

Sorry... that doesn't make sense FBaggins Nov 2016 #161

It's a double-edged sword. Aristus Nov 2016 #162

I'm not saying that their preferred policies in this example are correct FBaggins Nov 2016 #163

Well, I don't want anyone to suffer for any reason, Aristus Nov 2016 #165

I'm sure that's true... except for one thing FBaggins Nov 2016 #166

Well, they've got their own problems. Aristus Nov 2016 #169

People in all kinds of areas, including big cities, do these things cyberswede Nov 2016 #158

The overarching argument in all this is that people in rural areas felt left behind Aristus Nov 2016 #159

this . . . .n/t annabanana Dec 2016 #187

You confuse "small segment" with "edge of the bell curve." Beartracks Nov 2016 #29

Does that mean the black folks are not "ordinary?" Chinese folks are not "ordinary?" pangaia Nov 2016 #52

Counter-question: DetlefK Nov 2016 #80

Counter question.. pangaia Nov 2016 #110

We were talking about what counts as "ordinary" people. DetlefK Nov 2016 #117

Have you ever considered what people in rural areas think of big city people? spin Nov 2016 #65

Why is it important that I consider what people in rural areas think of big city people? Squinch Dec 2016 #194

Obviously rural people do not see that Democrats offer the better deal ... spin Dec 2016 #219

Well, given where we are today, I feel confident in saying that rural America has Squinch Dec 2016 #220

Trump made promises that he will never be able to complete. ... spin Dec 2016 #222

POC are about 20% of the population too. Do you consider them "unusual" or "unordinary"? jack_krass Nov 2016 #88

More like 37% of the population DemocratSinceBirth Nov 2016 #131

Basing "ordinariness" on a single factor is silly. cyberswede Nov 2016 #157

Well, I have green eyes, and I've always viewed myself as *extra*ordinary. pablo_marmol Dec 2016 #175

With bigger votes than ours treestar Nov 2016 #77

My interpretation of the post... LeftishBrit Nov 2016 #87

The poster "pointed it out"... without backing it up FBaggins Nov 2016 #93

... larger cities that they don't care about "Ordinary Americans" LIKE THEM. musicblind Nov 2016 #150

I was pretty careful with my use of scare quotes FBaggins Nov 2016 #160

The US has regions where change happens faster Lithos Dec 2016 #181

As someone who lives in one of these out-of-touch rural towns Horse with no Name Nov 2016 #4

Yeah, I grew up in one. I left, because there were no jobs. Recursion Nov 2016 #7

I'm not sure but the more secular the big cities become....the more religious the rural areas become Horse with no Name Nov 2016 #24

I left because I didn't want to be around uneducated fucking idiots snooper2 Nov 2016 #137

Stop making me laugh so hard bravenak Nov 2016 #148

Wholesome fun for the WHOLE family! hatrack Dec 2016 #209

You are so right about these churches rwheeler31 Nov 2016 #12

Save the babies, let the kids, adults and old people die. Their version of Christian sickens me. nt TeamPooka Nov 2016 #15

We don't have to do anything. The Republicans will do that for us. LonePirate Nov 2016 #6

Except that they don't care about facts. DetlefK Nov 2016 #84

Interesting.. virginia mountainman Nov 2016 #9

Yeah, I am Recursion Nov 2016 #20

Haw haw! It sure is a kneeslapper when the little people try to fight back! kcr Nov 2016 #91

It's crazy, right? /nt Marr Nov 2016 #119

They didn't win. They were scammed. And they are going to suffer for that. Squinch Dec 2016 #242

Wow, that sounds awfully condescending. LisaM Nov 2016 #10

Lies metroins Nov 2016 #13

We need progressive radio in rural areas Tumbulu Nov 2016 #16

Definitely!!! All they get fed is RW propaganda and RW religion. It's been going on a long time and RKP5637 Nov 2016 #112

Hate does sell well. Mariana Nov 2016 #144

Carve out a section of the AM Radio band DBoon Dec 2016 #180

Urbanites will control Dem votes their cities and maybe their states.... pipoman Nov 2016 #18

Not so fast. The repugs fuck up the economy with their policies every time. brush Nov 2016 #136

It almost sounds like you want it to stay. You almost sound like you think it's a good thing. musicblind Nov 2016 #153

Keep doing what you're doing expecting different results.... pipoman Nov 2016 #170

Boy, do you have that backwards. WillowTree Nov 2016 #22

Numbers Recursion Nov 2016 #32

i understand the point handmade34 Nov 2016 #97

Are those California vegetables grown in LA and San Francisco, or in rural areas? WillowTree Nov 2016 #103

An opinion of complete ignorance... pipoman Nov 2016 #115

I used to spend a lot of time in the Sacramento Valley, QC Dec 2016 #224

Yeah - "How do we make other people reach out" is quite backwards. lagomorph777 Dec 2016 #217

Insolent peasants! sarisataka Nov 2016 #25

start a "liberal" business and hire them JI7 Nov 2016 #30

What should we do? Here's what we should do. Shemp Howard Nov 2016 #33

How (realistically speaking ) do you envision those lost jobs coming back COLGATE4 Nov 2016 #43

That's a very good question! Shemp Howard Nov 2016 #50

More a wish than a plan. COLGATE4 Nov 2016 #51

Why do you want to give up so easily? Shemp Howard Nov 2016 #57

Interesting that the people who vote Republican - those same Republicans Squinch Dec 2016 #200

Apparently factory managers will run their businesses as charities Recursion Nov 2016 #67

That's my take on it, too. nt COLGATE4 Nov 2016 #99

Very good question bravenak Nov 2016 #149

Who is looking down on them? Who has shown prejudice against them and how have they done that? Squinch Dec 2016 #198

Oh, they'll realize WTF they did shortly world wide wally Nov 2016 #35

Republicans control both chambers in 32 states (17 with veto-proof majorities). SMC22307 Nov 2016 #37

I think I will. Medicaid cuts and SNAP reductions will resolve this in a few years Recursion Nov 2016 #38

Well, as Ed Koch said when he lost his last race, "The people have spoken and now they must pay." Squinch Dec 2016 #205

Spread THIS word: elleng Nov 2016 #39

I totally understand where Recursion is coming from jmowreader Nov 2016 #41

Thank you (nt) Recursion Nov 2016 #45

Keine probleme, Recursion. Guten abend. jmowreader Nov 2016 #46

But isn't this part of the larger problem? The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2016 #49

It really is; how the heck do we change that? jmowreader Nov 2016 #72

Well, you could go after misuse, rather than responsible ownership. benEzra Dec 2016 #174

I don't agree with this. I do get the impression that people in rural America feel they are Squinch Dec 2016 #206

Reminds me of Palin treestar Nov 2016 #78

Well, yes: that's the point Recursion Nov 2016 #113

Wow. blue neen Nov 2016 #48

I hope Oklahomans and Pennsylvanians keep fracking and ruining their LuvLoogie Nov 2016 #53

Ah, yes Oklahoma DFW Nov 2016 #86

start here with this article from dKos I posted earlier..... msongs Nov 2016 #54

1. Get control of the government Warpy Nov 2016 #55

What we need to do is mobilize voters in urban areas. herding cats Nov 2016 #59

Having lived in both we need to keep a open mind marlakay Nov 2016 #60

True...the condescending attitude towards 'fly over' country does our party no good. Demsrule86 Nov 2016 #95

I.live rural, work urban. gwheezie Nov 2016 #62

I'm sure if you lecture to them about how out of touch they are, they'll vote for your candidate. jfern Nov 2016 #64

Here in Kansas City rural and urban are all mixed leftyladyfrommo Nov 2016 #66

There is no "normal" America. 20% of America is still America. Kablooie Nov 2016 #69

Stop putting forth JesterCS Nov 2016 #71

. LWolf Nov 2016 #107

Nothing JustAnotherGen Nov 2016 #79

Wait and see? atreides1 Nov 2016 #81

I like rural Americans who are not ignorant white wing racists. They are a minority though. Hoyt Nov 2016 #82

I'm sorry I threw that pumpkin at you when you were doing B.R.A.G. dawg Nov 2016 #105

LOL. I lived in Macon for awhile, even the police harassed bike riders. Hoyt Nov 2016 #142

Let's send them all newspaper subscriptions. Vinca Nov 2016 #89

According to DU, we should Fuck'em (or at least the white ones) jack_krass Nov 2016 #90

I think you misunderstand LWolf Nov 2016 #98

Wow melman Nov 2016 #100

Really? Kilgore Nov 2016 #101

Ugh...none of this is an either/or situation vi5 Nov 2016 #104

All's we gotta do is out-vote them. dawg Nov 2016 #106

Ordinary? The plurality don't live in urban areas either. Most live in suburbs. Buckeye_Democrat Nov 2016 #108

College educations might help HAB911 Nov 2016 #109

#1 stop being regressive on the 2A. ileus Nov 2016 #111

Agree completely. DanTex Nov 2016 #114

"Ordinary Americans" being who? The DNC? Marr Nov 2016 #116

Yep. Buckeye_Democrat Nov 2016 #118

No, we won the working class by pretty high margins Recursion Nov 2016 #120

You're using national numbers to make a regional argument. Marr Nov 2016 #123

Clearly it is: 10 points is a landslide among that demographic Recursion Nov 2016 #134

Again, the party has a lead-- nationally-- with people living in poverty. Marr Nov 2016 #135

To which I can only say: Thanks, Debbie!!! Iggo Nov 2016 #138

This isn't complicated. DesmondFoster Nov 2016 #121

Let them suffer with the rest of us for the nightmare which they helped create. Paladin Nov 2016 #122

1976: Jimmy Carter won among rural white Southerners. Buckeye_Democrat Nov 2016 #129

Carter was totally because of Nixon marlakay Nov 2016 #139

Why did more white rural voters repudiate Nixon/Ford than other groups? Buckeye_Democrat Nov 2016 #141

I forgot about his farm background marlakay Nov 2016 #147

I also think that with Carter it was about the fact that he was one of them, in their minds, StevieM Dec 2016 #239

We work to make sure their votes don't matter. ileus Nov 2016 #133

Great idea liquid diamond Nov 2016 #155

How do you propose to do that....... WillowTree Nov 2016 #164

Your OP reveals a truth a lot of these posters don't want to face. musicblind Nov 2016 #154

eliminate every government benefit they have KatyMan Nov 2016 #167

Apparently they have no need to do much at all. Despite having a 6 million vote deficit from jmg257 Nov 2016 #168

If sarcasm were steel, you just bridged the Gulf of Mexico. Eleanors38 Nov 2016 #171

While we do not discuss politics in lodge ChazII Nov 2016 #172

Churches Bear Creek Nov 2016 #173

I sincerely hope this OP is meant as a parody. If not, then it's an embarrassment to have jonno99 Dec 2016 #176

Is it offensive that everyone is saying that the Democrats are out of touch because they didn't get Squinch Dec 2016 #238

Get rid of the Electoral College SHRED Dec 2016 #177

How do you propose to do that? WillowTree Dec 2016 #197

I understand it's a dream SHRED Dec 2016 #208

Same thing kcdoug1 Dec 2016 #178

Support rural public radio and TV DBoon Dec 2016 #179

THIS. A way to begin. Squinch Dec 2016 #204

That first sentence can explain in total why Hillary Clinton didn't get elected. Could it be doc03 Dec 2016 #182

Be condescending and advocate policies that don't serve their interests Taitertots Dec 2016 #184

Which of Hillary's policies didn't serve their interests? Which of Trump's policies did? Squinch Dec 2016 #192

YES! Flip the narrative! THEY need to come around to annabanana Dec 2016 #186

Or at least they need to quit beating themselves on the head with hammers. Squinch Dec 2016 #236

We pass policies to make it as hard to live in rural areas as possible. ileus Dec 2016 #188

What on earth are you talking about? We send flyover country *billions* Recursion Dec 2016 #189

That's what I said....we stop all funding and force them out of their lifestyle. ileus Dec 2016 #202

I can't decide if you're trolling the OP or if you're serious Abq_Sarah Dec 2016 #216

Wow. This seems self-explanatory to me, and yet everyone seems determined to Squinch Dec 2016 #191

Right? Recursion Dec 2016 #199

I have to say that before the election you pissed me right off with your thread on Squinch Dec 2016 #201

Maybe more tonedeaf condescending posts like this will help eom TransitJohn Dec 2016 #195

Is it tonedeaf and condescending to say that the Democratic party is out of touch because Squinch Dec 2016 #235

We should patronize them more. n/t QC Dec 2016 #196

Is it patronizing to say that the Democrats are out of touch with the rural voter? If not, then Squinch Dec 2016 #203

You can make a strong case that the party leaders are out of touch. QC Dec 2016 #223

You can also make a strong case that the rural voter is out of touch. They elected Trump. Squinch Dec 2016 #229

Lol...these people are ordinary Americans they just don't have same beachbum bob Dec 2016 #207

There have been lots of posts about why the Democratic party lost this election citood Dec 2016 #211

Don't treat them like toddlers Bradical79 Dec 2016 #212

I'm really sorry but this is bullshit. Clearly the guy who won was the one who treated them Squinch Dec 2016 #234

I didn't say we would win many of them over Bradical79 Dec 2016 #244

How about super fast broadband. Jobs programs helping renovate rural towns. hollowdweller Dec 2016 #213

Those were part of Hillary's plan. Twitler's plan was to lie to them and treat them like idiots. Squinch Dec 2016 #230

Want to know why the Democrats lost? HoustonDave Dec 2016 #214

And don't forget...........that 22% tends to exercise their right to vote. WillowTree Dec 2016 #215

It's hard to convince people that you are right on the issues and they are wrong... spin Dec 2016 #231

Except that NONE of that was anywhere in his statement. You are reading something into Squinch Dec 2016 #232

This message was self-deleted by its author Squinch Dec 2016 #233

How are those Americans not "ordinary Americans?" MineralMan Dec 2016 #218

I don't think there is much we can do now BigDemVoter Dec 2016 #225

This is really about the indie vote, not the rural vote. And we lost it this time. lindysalsagal Dec 2016 #228

I have been watching some the CNN reporters special and I quit half way through. JimBeard Dec 2016 #237

So it is fine to demean a minority MicaelS Dec 2016 #240

lulz Rex Dec 2016 #243