General Discussion

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

189. The ratio is not irrelevant to me, nor to any impartial observer.

Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:41 PM

Aug 2014

It is only irrelevant to people looking for excuses for Israeli war crimes. When Israel blows up a building with ten children in it based on the suspicion that a Hamas member might be visiting, that is murder. When Israel bulldozes the homes of the families of people it thinks are terrorists, that is a crime. Blowing up schools, hospitals, etc, these are crimes.

What is actually irrelevant are your hypotheticals about someone shooting up a market place with a hostage. And your speculation about what might have happened had Israel decided not to murder hundreds of Palestinian children is also irrelevant. Although I will say, I find it pretty shocking that people even try to pretend that the mass murder of civilians by Israel was necessary for "self-defense". Yes, I'm aware that's what Bibi Netanyahu claims, but I didn't think that there existed people gullible enough to believe him.

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Palestinians Have a Right to Defend Themselves! [View all] sabrina 1 Aug 2014 OP

Lobbing rockets by the thousands, two deaths, lobbing missiles and artillery, 2000 deaths. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #1

No one believes that the Hamas rocket attacks were aimed at military targets onenote Aug 2014 #2

Do Palestinians have the right to defend themselves in your opinion? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #3

If by defending themselves you mean firing rockets at civilians with no strategic defensive purpose. onenote Aug 2014 #5

The vast majority of unguided rockets go no where near populated sites, the ones that are, the few, Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #6

So are you saying that the Israelis don't have the right to intercept those missiles? onenote Aug 2014 #45

So you are saying you want to switch the talk away from 300 dead children as an appropriate Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #46

a thought NoMoreRepugs Aug 2014 #120

bingo! 7962 Aug 2014 #130

The rockets are mostly a symbolic gesture to protest the occupation. Chemisse Aug 2014 #204

So if one or more of these "mostly symbolic" rockets makes it through the Israeli defense onenote Aug 2014 #209

Just like scuds, V-1's V-2's etc.... Historic NY Aug 2014 #272

What do you mean 'they are put exactly where they think Israel won't strike'?? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #289

See below, Historic NY Aug 2014 #296

And? Israeli bombs landed right IN the UN building. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #297

I don't think Fred is saying that, nor is anyone else markpkessinger Aug 2014 #233

I think what the poster is saying is that notadmblnd Aug 2014 #80

Of course, they imply Palestinian lives do not matter, only Israeli children are precious. Evil. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #90

Post removed Post removed Aug 2014 #256

Our elected officials appear to agree with them. That Palestinian sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #117

I'm seeing that, and I'm ashamed of our elected officials notadmblnd Aug 2014 #119

I have never been more ashamed, and that is saying a lot. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #247

+1 Scuba Aug 2014 #268

"one Israeli life is worth more than a thousand Palestinian lives." EX500rider Aug 2014 #136

Rockets are only symbolic? delete_bush Aug 2014 #252

It's really a simple question. We just watched a month long brutal assault sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #8

Not one Israeli child with a scratch....300 dead, thousands wounded and traumatized....do the math. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #10

Any number of civilians killed in a military conflict is tragic onenote Aug 2014 #24

What was the number of children killed? The last report I saw sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #34

Again any number is tragic. onenote Aug 2014 #38

I saw a number of over 400. How many would be acceptable? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #111

None are acceptable. onenote Aug 2014 #129

If you stated to me that 120-200 Israeli children had been killed sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #251

While you are busy splitting hairs, any 'civilized society' louis-t Aug 2014 #103

So because lots of children died nothing that preceded it matters Lee-Lee Aug 2014 #70

The Palestinians should defend themselves get the red out Aug 2014 #89

Do you know what initiated this latest assault on the Palestinians? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #102

+100 840high Aug 2014 #214

Why do I keep seeing the same talking points over and over again? Are you saying sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #94

Decent people don't use children as shields Lee-Lee Aug 2014 #106

Decent people don't bomb desely populated areas where they know there sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #115

The world sees Hamas for the monsters they are Lee-Lee Aug 2014 #124

Well put +1000 (n/t) leftynyc Aug 2014 #135

"Hamas" is not the same thing as "Palestinians". Spider Jerusalem Aug 2014 #144

Actually you need to look at what the world's reaction to this really is. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #197

That's funny, because the people screaming about human shields are JoeyT Aug 2014 #212

And speaking of human shields, hat tip to DUer Bravenak in this thread for reminding me sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #254

Watch this video and then decide who the monsters are brush Aug 2014 #217

This message was self-deleted by its author Tumbulu Aug 2014 #227

........ daleanime Aug 2014 #267

"Decent people don't bomb densely populated areas" EX500rider Aug 2014 #139

You are right. And FDR was a very decent man. And Harry Truman was a decent man even totodeinhere Aug 2014 #166

FDR wasn't a decent man. Nor was Truman. The population bombing in WWII was mass murder. Vattel Aug 2014 #230

So does that mean all 2 million service men.. EX500rider Aug 2014 #232

no, it doesn't mean that Vattel Aug 2014 #234

So the guy who drops the bombs gets a pass... EX500rider Aug 2014 #235

Soldiers rarely have anywhere near the information available to those at the top Vattel Aug 2014 #236

Are you comparing Hitler to the Palestinians? Your question is so off this topic I am sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #239

You said "decent people don't bomb civilians" EX500rider Aug 2014 #253

Is Netanyahu a decent man? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #257

This message was self-deleted by its author Tumbulu Aug 2014 #226

The IDF fought for the RIGHT to CONTINUE using children as shields. bravenak Aug 2014 #178

Thank you, I remember reading about that. About the IDF using children as shields sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #240

You're welcome. I felt like i was screaming it from the moon.nt bravenak Aug 2014 #241

It's a very important point that needs to be stated to refute the talking point that sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #243

Please do. bravenak Aug 2014 #246

This message was self-deleted by its author sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #244

Thank you, Bravenak, for this. Israel has no moral authority regarding the Big Lie of human shields. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #291

You're welcome. And no, they don't have a monopoly on morals. bravenak Aug 2014 #298

I guess you haven't kept up Unknown Beatle Aug 2014 #195

Because Hamas was hiding in them SnakeEyes Aug 2014 #218

Seems like it worked like a charm leftynyc Aug 2014 #134

Like Israel? Scootaloo Aug 2014 #50

how about MFM008 Aug 2014 #186

Watch the video on this link . . . brush Aug 2014 #215

Under what circumstances do Palestinians have the right to self-defense? Scootaloo Aug 2014 #250

The current death toll is approx 1,800 Palistenian civilians including hundreds of children to rhett o rick Aug 2014 #264

The death of innocent civilians is tragic and to be avoided onenote Aug 2014 #270

thank you onenote. Puzzledtraveller Aug 2014 #308

Lobbing rockets at random isn't defense. NutmegYankee Aug 2014 #201

If that's all they have, after they were attacked by Netanyahu, he DID start this as you know sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #265

Do Palestinians have the right to encourage child martyrdom? FrodosPet Aug 2014 #224

This show has issues with its translation. Galraedia Aug 2014 #229

Civilians in Israel Capt. Obvious Aug 2014 #17

Even if you're saying that Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #39

They would be future soldiers then Capt. Obvious Aug 2014 #83

And even if they don't serve because of objections/exceptions, they still pay taxes... NutmegYankee Aug 2014 #202

And nobody believes that Israeli slaughter of innocent children is anything short of a war crime. DanTex Aug 2014 #33

That's not much of an argument. Are you trying to rationalize the killing of hundreds of rhett o rick Aug 2014 #263

Nits make lice. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #113

Fred's mistakes Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #133

If Americans were imprisoned by a racist and hostile enemy cpwm17 Aug 2014 #4

I don't think that's true oberliner Aug 2014 #29

But what if the US government were to respond to a few radicals sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #41

I oppose killing civilians oberliner Aug 2014 #59

We agree, I oppose it also, from all sides. So what can be done in this situation? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #121

Most palestinians not alligned with hamas SnakeEyes Aug 2014 #219

I'll be honest, and get flamed The Green Manalishi Aug 2014 #116

And if it was an Israeli bomb that landed on your home and killed, eg, eight or so sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #273

Most Americans supported the unprovoked attack against Iraq cpwm17 Aug 2014 #44

Most Palestinians oppose attacks on Israeli civilians oberliner Aug 2014 #53

Apparently you don't cpwm17 Aug 2014 #73

Huh? oberliner Aug 2014 #108

Your posts here on DU don't seem to reflect that. n/t cpwm17 Aug 2014 #110

Please direct me to any post of mine that expresses support for Israel attacking Gaza oberliner Aug 2014 #114

The Israeli Dahiya doctrine Unknown Beatle Aug 2014 #200

How many Americans support our unmanned drone attacks that have killed civilians? totodeinhere Aug 2014 #169

Way too many n/t cpwm17 Aug 2014 #262

False. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #142

This isn't about race. Most Palestinians and Israelis are the same race. n/t totodeinhere Aug 2014 #167

I understand that cpwm17 Aug 2014 #170

Actually some are. Still. n/t DeSwiss Aug 2014 #259

Are unguided rocket attacks on civilians "defending themselves"? N/T Taitertots Aug 2014 #7

Are hundreds of dead children a message that maybe you need a defense force sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #11

Yeah, they should dismantle their rockets and create a defensive force Taitertots Aug 2014 #68

What preceded the firing of rockets after more than a year of NO rockets? Do you know? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #85

It doesn't matter what preceded it. Indiscriminate rocket attacks on civilian targets are not... Taitertots Aug 2014 #99

Israel attacked Gaza, then the rockets started back up Marrah_G Aug 2014 #112

This is not true SnakeEyes Aug 2014 #220

No, they didn't. Netanyahu used the disappearance of three young Israelis as excuse to raid Gaza sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #266

Neither is an Israeli commando team storming the Krav Mara and killing civilians. Maedhros Aug 2014 #149

Exactly, isn't that what I have tried to say? 'Indiscriminate attacks on civilian sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #248

Symbolic resistance...what is the result of these rockets, someone should know..... Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #12

Symbolic resistance by firing rockets randomly without any effort to strike a military target. onenote Aug 2014 #26

You would rather they had guided missiles, your logic is fatally flawed. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #28

Your imagination is fertile, but corrupted. onenote Aug 2014 #32

Then why did Bibi reject the united Palestinian government that was ready to negotiate, just this Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #35

Did Hamas indicate it would recognize Israel's right to exist? onenote Aug 2014 #40

Of course, set preconditions, do not talk, bombs away....kill the children terrorists! Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #49

I guess we disagree then. I think recognizing your adversary's right to exist is legitimate onenote Aug 2014 #52

Because I see hundreds of dead children because of preconditions to talking....you do not. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #54

When was the last time Israel recognized Palestinian right to exist? louis-t Aug 2014 #88

sure, that's reasonable.. 2banon Aug 2014 #155

So then the Israeli 'guided' ones are purposely targeting civilians? JaydenD Aug 2014 #163

Yes. DeSwiss Aug 2014 #260

How do tunnels into Israel fit into that equation? nt hack89 Aug 2014 #9

Do Palestinians have a right to defend themselves? Yes or no. It's a simple question. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #13

Sure. They can have defensive weapons like rifles, machine guns and anti-tank missiles hack89 Aug 2014 #16

except they don't have anti-tank, anti-aircraft, anti-ship type weapons Marrah_G Aug 2014 #20

I Would Disagree, Sir The Magistrate Aug 2014 #25

The status quo is ok, I guess. hack89 Aug 2014 #55

But plenty of Palestinians are no big deal? Marrah_G Aug 2014 #78

It is a big deal. But a real war would be a different matter all together hack89 Aug 2014 #92

I Would Agree, Sir, That The Present Leadership, Of Hamas Particularly The Magistrate Aug 2014 #95

Can Israel have offensive weapons like rockets? And if Palestinians were imprisoning sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #47

Do you want Hamas to be able to wage a true conventional war against Israel? hack89 Aug 2014 #63

I honestly don't understand how you think Marrah_G Aug 2014 #87

You put water on fires, not gasoline. hack89 Aug 2014 #96

The same can be said about Israel though Marrah_G Aug 2014 #109

"Real war?" What do you call the events of the past month? Skidmore Aug 2014 #118

War like in Syria hack89 Aug 2014 #137

I see. Skidmore Aug 2014 #141

It is very naive to think ... hack89 Aug 2014 #174

What I want is some recognition of the fact that Skidmore Aug 2014 #190

The people of Gaza are paying a heavy price for some poor choices hack89 Aug 2014 #191

The same formula used in the Warsaw ghetto, prisoners trying to escape...wouldn't you? Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #14

They were not for escaping. They were for attacking. hack89 Aug 2014 #19

And you think killing 300 children and turning a city into the moon is a good thing in response? Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #23

We are talking about the tunnels remember? nt hack89 Aug 2014 #37

Gee whiz, how rude of me to talk about the dead children....so sorry. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #42

So Hamas diverted tons of material and money from building civilian infrastructure to build tunnels hack89 Aug 2014 #69

Well it is impossible for those tunnels to be used for delivering food and medicine Rex Aug 2014 #75

That is related to the question of whether or not Palestinians have a right to defend sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #51

So how are tunnels into Israel self defense? hack89 Aug 2014 #65

Sure, no way they are getting supplies (food and medicine) through those tunnels. Rex Aug 2014 #71

Demonization, even of children, is the evil embraced as policy....it is evil. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #74

I just find it curious how the most obvious use is getting ignored for Rex Aug 2014 #81

The smuggling tunnels go into Egypt hack89 Aug 2014 #276

What would Americans do if they were imprisoned on a small piece of land? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #72

No sorry, those tunnels are evil incarnate. The Palestinians should be forced to stay Rex Aug 2014 #84

We could play this game forever, in fact I suspect it HAS been played over and over sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #238

Because of Hamas hack89 Aug 2014 #245

Why? Because they have a predilection for bombing shit and kidnapping TheKentuckian Aug 2014 #294

Why do you think the Palestinians are angry in the first place? They didn't just one day sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #295

They were angry in the first place because Israel is there and that is not negotiable so what now? TheKentuckian Aug 2014 #306

Well, what you are saying is that this is a permanent situation. That only violence can sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #307

I'm trying to find the number of Israeli's killed by people using the tunnels into Israel Marrah_G Aug 2014 #66

Answer is Zero, Zero and Zero. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #77

No, the answer is not zero. EX500rider Aug 2014 #147

Sorry, just a tad above zero....I apologize, meant in recent history, not ancient. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #179

4 of those were in 2014....how is that "ancient"? EX500rider Aug 2014 #205

Zero children, versus 2000 dead civilians, 300 children. The math is indisputable, indefensible. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #207

Such tunnels would basically be a one time deal hack89 Aug 2014 #86

The resistance from the Warsaw ghetto was not directed at German civilians. onenote Aug 2014 #30

Not surprising. The Warsaw ghetto didn't have much access to German civilians. Rozlee Aug 2014 #237

Wow. And wow again. onenote Aug 2014 #242

A rose by any other name. Rozlee Aug 2014 #255

and whoosh..there goes your devotion to proportionality onenote Aug 2014 #269

That is NOT what the poster said, not even close. Please do not put words sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #278

The poster treated the "mass exterminations" suffered by Jews as comparable to the onenote Aug 2014 #279

And therein lies the rub. Rozlee Aug 2014 #281

Here is a solution I think should satisfy all Hamas shills and sympathizers. Dreamer Tatum Aug 2014 #15

I'd like to see the Hamas lovers respond to this! Capt. Obvious Aug 2014 #18

I wish Israel would lob unguided rockets into all of the Gaza strip randomly...no problem...about Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #27

Better Technology = Unfair 4Q2u2 Aug 2014 #76

National military armed to the teeth versus a militia in prison...take off the blinders. Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #82

Who me or Hamas? 4Q2u2 Aug 2014 #101

Pro-Likud propaganda. Maedhros Aug 2014 #151

Asking Leaders to think of Their People First is propaganda? 4Q2u2 Aug 2014 #277

What did they expect? Not the guilt free slaughter of hundreds of babies and children. Only a Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #185

The Palestinians are under a brutal occupation cpwm17 Aug 2014 #31

You say Israel is the aggressor like it's a fact Dreamer Tatum Aug 2014 #145

What happens if a Palestinian goes more than three miles off of his own coast? cpwm17 Aug 2014 #154

Yes, he is. Maedhros Aug 2014 #153

Thank you for that cpwm17 Aug 2014 #160

Apparently so. Post I replied to no longer appears. Weird. [n/t] Maedhros Aug 2014 #173

Great Idea! BKH70041 Aug 2014 #48

Your facts are wrong BainsBane Aug 2014 #56

I have mentioned Hamas firing rockets. I pointed out that Hamas had not fired rockets sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #57

its really easy to justify things SnakeEyes Aug 2014 #221

Well, random fire would probably be less damaging than targeted strikes at schools and hospitals. DanTex Aug 2014 #79

as opposed to what -- women/babykilling sympathizers and supporters stupidicus Aug 2014 #128

You mean like the Japanese defended themselves from the US fleet at Pearl Harbor? Fozzledick Aug 2014 #21

How about both sides having a 'right to defend themselves' that doesn't involve Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #22

Good post, I agree with that. Go the political route. Now is a good time to do that imo. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #64

Israel would not cooperate with the ICC and nor would it hand over anyone found guilty by them Marrah_G Aug 2014 #104

Yes the people of Gaza have a right to defend themselves. hrmjustin Aug 2014 #36

Thank you, I agree with that. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #61

Your welcome. hrmjustin Aug 2014 #62

correct posting Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #148

Israel is not justified on firing on civilians when they know they are there. hrmjustin Aug 2014 #150

the difference between the supposed crimes. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #172

The fact how many deaths are fighters is contested. hrmjustin Aug 2014 #177

Not so clear. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #183

So! The NYT is not the decider of fact. hrmjustin Aug 2014 #187

Only one side has the right to be militarized malaise Aug 2014 #43

Good point. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #152

"I believe everyone has a right to defend themselves." Garthem Aug 2014 #58

A question: onenote Aug 2014 #60

If they were in an open air prison with 3 exits, surrounded by enemies, you left that part out.... Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #67

Does a prison have a large library SnakeEyes Aug 2014 #222

It also has no power plant and a lunar landscape.....tourist attractions? You with The Onion? Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #223

It WAS. But the US Govt overpowered them. Maybe if they had had more powerful sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #97

I"ve stated what i think several times: onenote Aug 2014 #131

Sure, when attacked or under threat of attack. Igel Aug 2014 #91

Whoever is the aggressor in a war has no such right of "defense'" since they are the OFFense. Pick WinkyDink Aug 2014 #93

So who is the aggressor in this situation? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #100

Have you not your own opinion? WinkyDink Aug 2014 #182

If you start a fight and get your ass kicked, can you continue to fight and claim self defense? badtoworse Aug 2014 #107

Well, Netanyahu started this fight, by lying about the three young men who were sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #123

I differentiate between rhetoric and actual aggressive action badtoworse Aug 2014 #126

Well, Israel is constantly the aggressor with respect to Palestine. DanTex Aug 2014 #192

So who actually started shooting? badtoworse Aug 2014 #208

IDF started shooting. Operation Brother's Keeper was a military raid in the West Bank. DanTex Aug 2014 #211

The article doesn't provide any details about the shootings badtoworse Aug 2014 #274

So, what, you don't think they happened? DanTex Aug 2014 #275

A lot of things happened and I don't dispute that those people were killed. badtoworse Aug 2014 #283

Tell it to the OP. You made MY point. WinkyDink Aug 2014 #181

They Count on Sympathy ProgressiveJarhead Aug 2014 #98

K&R Thanks for posting this! mwrguy Aug 2014 #105

There was a time when they refused to speak out against tobacco. Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #122

Cannot allow civilians deaths to go unpunished. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #125

Funny how the ones actually doing the killing are 100% blameless. arcane1 Aug 2014 #132

I read that post and laughed at the ridiculousness of what that poster wrote notadmblnd Aug 2014 #156

blame Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #157

Tell me this is sarcasm. DanTex Aug 2014 #143

False. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #159

Well, if you count all of the additional deaths that Israel has caused by the inevitable DanTex Aug 2014 #164

crime by inspiration Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #168

Actually, I blame the person doing the murdering. DanTex Aug 2014 #171

Murder due to inspiration vs. Murder due to human shields. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #176

Both are indirectly causing murders. DanTex Aug 2014 #180

Murder as defined by law. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #188

The ratio is not irrelevant to me, nor to any impartial observer. DanTex Aug 2014 #189

I myself am not shocked that there are gullible people. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #228

I doubt your hypothetical 9-11 claims. DanTex Aug 2014 #258

cowardly censorship Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #299

You didn't answer my question. Are you an NRA member? DanTex Aug 2014 #304

Human shields, what do you think of people who fight for the right sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #271

And, we have a right to defend Palestinians through non-violent means. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #127

not enough non-violent means. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #162

Which we need more non-violent means which could be effective. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #165

accidentally aiding terrorists. Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #175

Yeah, the US needs to stop funding Israeli state terrorism immediately. DanTex Aug 2014 #261

As of this date . . . Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #300

Yeah, and Dick Cheney wasn't either. DanTex Aug 2014 #303

I don't think i have seen you post anything positive on DU. stonecutter357 Aug 2014 #138

You don't think that acknowledging that everyone has the same rights is 'positive'? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #193

Well then you must not read this site much. Rex Aug 2014 #203

you gotta be careful Sabrina RedstDem Aug 2014 #140

To which "fascist trolls" do you refer? MineralMan Aug 2014 #158

They can't both be on the defensive, unless there is a 3rd Party involved. Otherwise, it's detente. WinkyDink Aug 2014 #184

Lol, well I am not too concerned about name calling, been called everything by Right Wingers sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #194

Everyone does. deathrind Aug 2014 #146

:^( Adam051188 Aug 2014 #161

Love him. Thanks for the video. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #198

Who's arguing otherwise? Nobody's condemned them for shooting back at Israel's invading forces Hippo_Tron Aug 2014 #196

If you read the OP you will see why I felt the need to make the statement. If you can sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #199

That was the point of this thread and so far I havent heard it either randys1 Aug 2014 #206

Yes. They do. They should have built a wall about 60 years JDPriestly Aug 2014 #210

Good post. 840high Aug 2014 #216

Both sides insist on their "right to defend themselves." Both also want to be treated like a wounded chrisa Aug 2014 #213

No comparison Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #231

...^ that 840high Aug 2014 #249

Reommend! I haven't heard any Elected Official make that statement... KoKo Aug 2014 #225

Every living thing has that right. davidthegnome Aug 2014 #280

That is an excellent post, should be an OP on its own There is nothing I can add except sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #284

Common sense should prevail. davidthegnome Aug 2014 #288

An Israeli death by a Palestinian is on the front page swilton Aug 2014 #282

If the Palestinian deaths are all the fault of Hamas, why does the media hide them? Fred Sanders Aug 2014 #293

that is because Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #301

would any of you Israeli apologists support the same destruction of a building or.. politicman Aug 2014 #285

That argument, that Hamas forced the IDF to kill children, is one of the least sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #286

we are still seeing it because Israeli apologists are well trained propagandists. politicman Aug 2014 #287

Well, if anyone thinks that is the way to persuade people to support them, I think sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #290

Let's say . . . Ahmed Aftab Aug 2014 #302

They do. NCTraveler Aug 2014 #292

K&R woo me with science Aug 2014 #305