General Discussion

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)

133. Thanks

Tue Feb 25, 2014, 12:27 PM

Feb 2014

It just strikes me that less than 10% in Parliament of far right fascists does not a right wing take over make. By that logic the US is in the depths of a fascist take over, 15-20% of the House tea party caucus is well TP, and we are having pretty fascist laws at the state level. Just point to AZ and WV for example.

Yes, the street fighters were from Right Wing fascist groups, but once elections come and the Sboda wins 30%+ of seats in Parliament and controls the executive I will join you.

Some folks are in a panic due to the echoes of WWII. Well, to those fools I would point out France, where the RW has a tad more of a grasp of power, Greece, which has the same situation, and the unlearned lesson of the 1920s, austerity policies are leading to this rise in RW fascist policies.

They keep planting that flag though.

But thanks, I read those sources and thought to myself, these folks are in a panic and are about to re fight WW II, well it is not yet WW II, not even close to mid 1930s, not even the Reichstag burning. That danger has been under the surface since 1945. The nationalist parties all over Europe did not die. But the austerity parties are the ones pulling that raw scab.

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So the neo-Nazis have seized power in Ukraine [View all] malaise Feb 2014 OP

It appearts that ultra RW factions have successfully overthrown democratically elected governments kelliekat44 Feb 2014 #1

The neo-cons are having a field day malaise Feb 2014 #2

Damn Obama! AAO Feb 2014 #3

Wasn't that Nancy's job in the House n/t malaise Feb 2014 #4

No. It would have been the Attorney General, Eric Holder Cali_Democrat Feb 2014 #6

Yes, - I was just imitating a teabagger response to anything going wrong. AAO Feb 2014 #137

The neo-cons were hired by Yunokovych's government. Anyone with half a brain has already okaawhatever Feb 2014 #25

John McCain met with the leaders of Svoboda: freshwest Feb 2014 #91

Of course the article doesn't mention that Arseniy Yatsenyuk is the member of the largest political okaawhatever Feb 2014 #103

I thought my links were good, Telegraph, BBC and Reutiers. But what are neo-cons and people that are freshwest Feb 2014 #140

What the hell are you talking about?? madinmaryland Feb 2014 #5

Well, apparently neo-nazis have seized control in Ukraine or something. Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #13

I heard it was a carton of 'Neopolitan' ice cream. (yes, sic, I know.) nt Common Sense Party Feb 2014 #37

I'm always ready to mix neo-cons with neo-nazis and neo-feudalists like Rand. All the same to me. freshwest Feb 2014 #89

Who Coulda Known? The Syria Playbook? KoKo Feb 2014 #7

The protestors (led by that prime minister lady that didn't get re-elected) Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #8

Someone was feeding the frenzy malaise Feb 2014 #9

Yes, that prime minister that didn't get re-elected. Yulia whatever-her-name and her fans nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #14

Sweet Jesus, Yulia Timoshenko, not whats-her-name maxsolomon Feb 2014 #34

Yes, she. And her fans. They propelled this, with the aid of the EU and the U.S. Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #38

She propelled it from a prison hospital with an injured back? maxsolomon Feb 2014 #43

Of course. How do leaders propel things? By duplicating themselves into thousands? nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #45

I saw her speak from the wheelchair after her supporters got her out of jail/prison. freshwest Feb 2014 #139

it was in a report i read in the NYT maxsolomon Feb 2014 #143

This is a better video than the one I saw last night: freshwest Feb 2014 #144

I don't care for her, but some sources say she and Putin used to work well together. freshwest Feb 2014 #90

She wasn't re-elected. Then there was an issue of corruption. Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #135

Yes, much better if they just do whatever Uncle Pootie tells him. Adrahil Feb 2014 #16

Please translate n/t malaise Feb 2014 #19

Fixed. Stupid iPad. Adrahil Feb 2014 #23

Radical anarchists collaborating with Neo-Nazis? Throd Feb 2014 #17

A few started it, then the real nuts (fascists) got involved, and the rest is history and hell nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #18

Perhaps Ukrainians would rather have a functioning democracy versus Putin's vassal state. Throd Feb 2014 #27

Instead, they have Neo-Nazi chaos. nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #30

Perhaps you should try a more reliable source for your info. Any of the reputable international news okaawhatever Feb 2014 #20

Alternet, perhaps? Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #35

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! malaise Feb 2014 #42

+1. nt. polly7 Feb 2014 #48

I don't consider Alternet a reliable source. Yes the ultra nationalists group is participating in okaawhatever Feb 2014 #49

No? What do you consider a reliable source? Any source that agrees with your premise? nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #54

No, Reuters, The Associated Press, New York Times, The Economist................nt okaawhatever Feb 2014 #107

The corporate entities whose intent is to hide what's really going? nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #134

They're fascists. And they're in coalition with two center-right parties, making them the majority El_Johns Feb 2014 #86

Svoboda is not the majority. They aren't the majority in the opposition even. The majority of the okaawhatever Feb 2014 #108

The coalition that includes Svobada is the majority. As was perfectly obvious/ El_Johns Feb 2014 #112

You don't consider Alternet a reliable source -- why is that? You think it's in bed with Putin? El_Johns Feb 2014 #114

Alternet is an often unreliable / iffy source. Quantess Feb 2014 #132

Articles on Alternet are only as good as their authors. The article in reference doesn't provide okaawhatever Feb 2014 #152

Good points there! What is Alternet's angle in promoting Russian PR, though? freshwest Feb 2014 #159

If you dont consider Alternet a reliable source, what do you consider? CNN? ABC? nm rhett o rick Feb 2014 #146

According the the Alternet article.... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #53

But would 30% be neo-Nazis? El_Johns Feb 2014 #83

The article pretty much lumped them together Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #105

The alternet article has zero credibility and I think your pointing out that they're saying the same okaawhatever Feb 2014 #109

I generally like Alternet... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #110

because you say so? El_Johns Feb 2014 #122

Why would western powers back any kind of Nazi? FFS, WW2! And we're accused by the RWNJs of freshwest Feb 2014 #153

Because sometimes you don't get the luxury of picking your friends...(nt) Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #155

I don't see the analogy between Ukrainians fighting it out and Americans invading freshwest Feb 2014 #161

For those that dream of revolution to throw off the chains of oppression, take notice. rhett o rick Feb 2014 #10

Kafka... Jeff In Milwaukee Feb 2014 #51

Those who confuse democracy and chains of oppression deserve what they get. Coyotl Feb 2014 #127

You must be responding to the wrong post. "when you cheer on anarchy destroying a stable nation." rhett o rick Feb 2014 #141

This malaise Feb 2014 #148

We wish to tear down all governments that we dont have in our pocket and replace them with rhett o rick Feb 2014 #149

.......... Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #11

Isn't that second pic The Cat from Red Dwarf? Loved that series. n/t freshwest Feb 2014 #150

Great, but I saw some duers cheering this on quinnox Feb 2014 #12

No, some of us have bothered to learn the truth. I suggest you do the same. nt okaawhatever Feb 2014 #22

I just did a google search "neo-nazis" and "ukraine" and got tons of hits quinnox Feb 2014 #26

I just did a google search of "neo-nazis" and "Democratic Underground." Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #29

"Neo-nazis" and "Olive Garden": Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #36

Neo-Nazis + Diapers = 8,570,000 hits Throd Feb 2014 #47

Brilliant. I wonder what would happen if you did neo-Nazi and Republican party.........nt okaawhatever Feb 2014 #50

Aw, c'mon fuckin' nazi! Dr. Strange Feb 2014 #71

Well, he is a skinhead. Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #76

Neo-Nazi and Pepperoni Pizza Vinnie From Indy Feb 2014 #84

Just goes to show how hard Putin's propaganda machine is working. I noticed most of the claims about okaawhatever Feb 2014 #46

Neo-nazis and African Traditional Music turns up nearly 2 million results. Kurska Feb 2014 #63

As a Jew, I find it incredibly offensive that you throw that term around with zero understanding. nt Kurska Feb 2014 #15

I select my own words malaise Feb 2014 #24

Opposing Russian Hegemony doesn't make you a neo-nazi Kurska Feb 2014 #28

For some around here it does. Throd Feb 2014 #32

What term? Neo-Nazi? Is there another term that should be used perhaps? nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #55

Yeah this guy is totally a Neo-Nazi what was I thinking Kurska Feb 2014 #59

Um, no, he's not. But there are Neo-Nazis going crazy on the streets of Ukraine... Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #65

Please find me a single credibly link detailing how the Neo-Nazis have seized control in the Ukraine Kurska Feb 2014 #68

I've posted two already, but your side doesn't like my selections. nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #69

Yeah Ukraine just absolutely crawlin with Nazis right now. Kurska Feb 2014 #72

And you're right in the thick of that wonderful wonderland, right? That's how you know so much Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #73

Well, your selections don't tell the truth. Scootaloo Feb 2014 #78

Actually, many people agree with me. The net is filled with this info., so why would you think Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #79

Truth is not a popularity contest Scootaloo Feb 2014 #82

No, you're right about that. But truth is somewhere, right? And who has it? Is it you? Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #136

I dunno, but it's not the people screaming that Ukraine has been taken over by neo-nazis Scootaloo Feb 2014 #147

Say you, claiming that *you* are the correct one. Didn't work. Try again. nt Sarah Ibarruri Feb 2014 #154

Yulia Tymoshenko was accused of being a secret Jew in the last election. EmilyAnne Feb 2014 #87

As a Jew, you should be aware that the Ukranian collaboraters helped massacre Ukranian Jews by Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #56

I wasn't aware Nazism was genetically transferred n/t Kurska Feb 2014 #57

You should be aware that there is a long history fascist sympathy in the region. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #58

I'm actually a minor scholar on the eastern front of world war II Kurska Feb 2014 #61

so had I said "all of the ukranian opposition are neo nazis" you might have a point. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #64

Um you are aware you're posting in a thread that claims the Neo-nazis seized control? Kurska Feb 2014 #66

Again, is it your claimn that there are no fascist groups in the opposition? Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #67

There are Neo-Nazis opposed to smoking. Kurska Feb 2014 #70

So you agree that there are neo-nazi groups in the opposition. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #95

Are you a white American? Scootaloo Feb 2014 #80

Yeah well I don't deny we have a sordid history and a problematic present. Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #96

I find your lack of understanding history in Ukraine offensive frwrfpos Feb 2014 #75

You mean like this guy? Kurska Feb 2014 #77

As others have noted, probably referring the Svoboda party Scootaloo Feb 2014 #85

recommend frwrfpos Feb 2014 #21

Can I inquire as to your source for this? Because while I know that there are some TwilightGardener Feb 2014 #31

Peace-loving Government troops firing on the "neo-Nazis' brooklynite Feb 2014 #33

Why should the Ukraine not be in trade zones with both the EU and Russia? I'm sure that applegrove Feb 2014 #39

I'm not sure why the two trade markets can't work together. They have to iron this out. Russia's gas freshwest Feb 2014 #145

Sudstream... go west young man Feb 2014 #158

Thank you, that was very informative and I checked out Gasprom as well. I try to take such factors freshwest Feb 2014 #160

Is the U.S. Backing Neo-Nazis in Ukraine? Zorra Feb 2014 #40

Um.....no. You're extremely wrong. jeff47 Feb 2014 #41

Wrong (nt) bigwillq Feb 2014 #44

ROFLMAO. Brickbat Feb 2014 #52

Source nadinbrzezinski Feb 2014 #60

Pravda comrade Kurska Feb 2014 #62

Several sources malaise Feb 2014 #92

Thanks nadinbrzezinski Feb 2014 #133

Radio Armenia Bad Thoughts Feb 2014 #99

You apparently don't read anything. kwassa Feb 2014 #74

Wow, I only belatedly realized this thread wasn't satire. tritsofme Feb 2014 #81

The stupid is strong with many here Pretzel_Warrior Feb 2014 #88

They want to discredit the uprising so they invent reasons why we shouldn't like it. stevenleser Feb 2014 #113

Thankfully....your incessant insults... go west young man Feb 2014 #162

As I understand it, the interim President is a member of the All-Ukrainian Union "Fatherland" party justiceischeap Feb 2014 #93

Facts. Acting president/PM, finance minister, interior minister - none are from Svoboda muriel_volestrangler Feb 2014 #94

bzzt. fail. simplistic and uniformed. and I'm someone who has posted cali Feb 2014 #97

Svoboda Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #98

Doesn't change the fact they're not even close to the majority party in the country. Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #101

"No one's denying Svoboda's there" Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #102

They're not a major factor in the opposition. And they certainly haven't "seized power". Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #104

They're in a formal coalition with two centre right parties and the coalition IS the majority El_Johns Feb 2014 #115

Right, but they're not even the bulk of the coalition. Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #117

They're in formal coalition and have been since 2012. El_Johns Feb 2014 #119

Do you understand parliamentary politics? Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #123

I understand very well. It does mean that there's quid pro quo, however. El_Johns Feb 2014 #125

But the insinuation that fascists and neo-nazis are leading the shots is just not documented. nt Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #131

We don't really know who's calling the shots, do we? El_Johns Feb 2014 #156

I'm forced to conclude that person does not understand parliamentary politics. stevenleser Feb 2014 #129

That is not Svoboda: okaawhatever Feb 2014 #106

Yankees OilemFirchen Feb 2014 #111

I love it when the argument goes from "there are no nazis, that's just stupid" to Warren Stupidity Feb 2014 #142

Posts 93 and 94 for the win. The interim President is not from Svoboda. NeoNazis are not in charge stevenleser Feb 2014 #100

They're in a formal political coalition with the party of the interim president and Tymoshenko's El_Johns Feb 2014 #116

There are several big problems with your assertion. stevenleser Feb 2014 #121

My assertion is a fact. It's also a fact that 'pro-west' sections of Ukraine are also the sections El_Johns Feb 2014 #124

No, it's not. It WAS a fact. Everything is changing now. nt stevenleser Feb 2014 #126

What are the 'new' facts? El_Johns Feb 2014 #128

I reiterate Carcetti's question to you above. Do you understand Parliamentary politics? stevenleser Feb 2014 #130

I believe I already answered that question. El_Johns Feb 2014 #157

He's a Baptist according to the Southern Baptist Convention. Lars39 Feb 2014 #165

The communist view is that this TBF Feb 2014 #118

The west is also the stronghold of Svoboda. El_Johns Feb 2014 #120

Only in John McCain's wet dreams. bullwinkle428 Feb 2014 #138

If that is true, and Ukraine can't push them out, I do not think Russia will just sit by lostincalifornia Feb 2014 #151

Well it's not actually true. Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2014 #163

I was skeptical, and didn't think it was true, thanks. Also, unfortunately, looking at what Putin lostincalifornia Feb 2014 #164