People (some) on this board wonder why I won't shut up about DWS's atrocious record. Here's why.

[Warren DeMontague]

Stuart woman faces 10 years in prison in medical marijuana case

"I'm a patient, not a criminal," Kirouac says. "I have no criminal background whatsoever."

According to court documents, in 2014 deputies followed Kirouac home from a hydroponics store. A detective testified Thursday that there was a suspicion that Kirouac was growing marijuana.

Hearing fans and smelling a strong odor, law enforcement executed a search the next day and uncovered 20 marijuana plants growing in her home.

Michael Minardi, Kirouac's attorney, argued not only was the search illegal, but Kirouac as the right to use the marijuana.

Lets, as they say, "unpack" this for a moment. Here's a 50 year old woman with health issues in Florida, never had any problems with the law, not presenting a menace to public safety or endangering anyone or really doing ANYTHING 'questionable' beyond shopping at a hydroponics store, cops follow her home and now she's gonna go to prison for 10 years for growing her own medical marijuana.

Feel Safer? How exactly is the taxpayer served by this? The greater society?

The anti-legalization, pro-prohibition people LOVE to go on about how "oh, no one is in prison for pot" and only the dangerous baddies are in prison because it's simply LUDICROUS to imagine that in 2016 we're locking people up for weed and nothing else.

Bullshit, here you have cops who followed this woman home from the damn hydroponics store, and based upon that alone now she's a dangerous criminal worth a decade in prison. No prior offenses, no violence, nothing, plus she had a medical marijuana recommendation from the state she moved from.

And even if she didn't- 10 years for a bunch of plants? She wasn't hurting anyone, hell, there's zero evidence she was growing those plants for anyone but herself. She just moved there. What the fuck?

Which is where we get back to Debbie Wasserman Schultz and her record on marijuana reform. You can draw a direct line from DWS working with Sheldon Adelson to shoot down Florida's last attempt to legalize medical marijuana, and the fact that this woman is facing a decade in Florida prison.

[hereforthevoting]

1. I mean, it would be different

if she wasn't coincidentally propped up by certain companies.

[Warren DeMontague]

2. A complete coincidence

I'm sure!

[CincyDem]

37. Hey now...we know that "propping" has no influence on decision making.

[kevinmc]

3. The Florida Senate - The Florida House of Representatives

I don't see how she is able to control the The Florida Senate - The Florida House of Representatives to do anything she would want.



The Florida Senate

Party As of May 2016

Democratic Party 14

Republican Party 26

Total 40

The Florida House of Representatives

Party As of May 2016

Democratic Party 39

Republican Party 81

Total 120

[Warren DeMontague]

4. She actively worked to defeat it in 2014, in alliance with Sheldon Adelson

And she is looking to stop it again.

So yes. Politicians are not just responsible for their votes- like the votes she cast in the house against a bill telling the DEA to respect state medical marijuana laws- they are ALSO responsible for the advocacy they do for or against locally important issues and measures.

http://observer.com/2016/03/more-reason-to-hate-debbie-wasserman-schultz-her-ridiculous-war-on-medical-marijuana/

https://www.hellomd.com/health-wellness/debbie-wasserman-schultz-on-the-wrong-side-of-marijuana-issues


You want to give her a pass? Really?

[tom_kelly]

22. I know John Morgan (Morgan & Morgan) has been very active

in pushing for legalization. Since I've moved from Tampa to Boca (DWS' backyard) I haven't heard anything but am hoping there's been progress.

[RobertEarl]

5. Just imagine if Florida elections had a history of deceit

Why the republicans would control all of the government if they could manipulate the vote.

The MM amendment to the constitution in Florida just missed being passed by a few percentage points.

[Warren DeMontague]

6. "Not her fault!"

Or some shit.

[RobertEarl]

7. She's not connected at all

Just an innocent bystander.

Florida elections are the cleanest in the whole country, ever since 2001, anyway. After 2000 they outlawed hand recounts of ballots, vote counts are so pure.

[d_legendary1]

31. You sure about that pure elections claim?

They just arrested a guy for hacking into the Florida data base. If this can be done by a guy who is reporting on vulnerabilities you can imagine what malicious people who've already stolen the state can do on election day.

[Warren DeMontague]

36. I think he's being sarcastic.

[rhett o rick]

43. You avoid commiting yourself as to whether you belive that people

suffering from sever conditions should be allowed to use medical marijuana. Now Clinton thinks they should suffer because she hasn't figured out how to profit from it.

[fbc]

8. kick and rec

[Lunabell]

9. I can't stamd the sound of her voice.

Her evil slimy ways are even worse.

[emsimon33]

10. K&R

[Warren DeMontague]

11. Denny Hastert is gonna get, what, 15 months for molesting kids?

Good thing he didn't commit a real crime, like grow some pot in his basement to help his glaucoma.

[YOHABLO]

44. I agree someone who advocated life sentences for child molesters gets 15 months .. what a joke.

[Warren DeMontague]

47. It seems unbelievable to me. 15 months. And this woman is facing 10 years.

Apparently growing pot for yourself is like 6 times a far more serious crime than abusing children.

[Amimnoch]

12. Victimless crime should go the way of the dinosaur period.

Every time the government prosecutes anyone for any crime where no victim of a crime existed then the government is the one who is guilty of creating a victim of the crime and should be held accountable the way any other person who victimizes an innocent person is accountable.

[Warren DeMontague]

13. That's a good point.

Instead of justice, you are making injustice.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

68. Yes. Victimless crimes---the bullshit of that whole concept....

It just..makes me...
... .....

[Feeling the Bern]

14. She's an HRC flunkie. With the hard right swing on this board right now, DWS is the bee's knees.

In fact, I'm going to go out on a limb and say it won't be too long before people try to rehab Ben Nelson, Zell Miller and Joe Lieberman.

[n2doc]

15. The Prison-Industrial Complex thanks her n/t

[silvershadow]

16. You shouldn't shut up about it. She was in collusion with the HRC campaign from the time

HRC early-announced and then was swiftly crowned the Presumptuous Nominee. The collusion was covered up when the truce was reached on Debbie-gate.

She has an agenda. It is more than transparent.

She is *not who I want leading my party forward.

PS: I am supporting Tim Canova for Florida's 23rd this cycle...you should too!

https://timcanova.com

Donate thru Act Blue DU for Tim Canova: https://secure.actblue.com/contribute/page/du4timcanova

[Warren DeMontague]

17. Yeah, ive been supporting Canova from the get-go too.

Thanks for the links.

[silvershadow]

18. yw! nt

[Volaris]

21. If she loses that primary?

Is she still the head is the DNC? As in, can she hold that position without being an elected member of the Party?

I know Pribus over on the Crazy Side isn't elected to Congressional Squat, not sure what our rules are..

[aggiesal]

23. Howard Dean was head of the DNC ...

and he wasn't holding any elected office at the time.

So to answer your questions, DebtTrapDebbie will remain head of the DNC
if she still gets primary'ed.

[lordsummerisle]

19. k&r n/t

[Dont call me Shirley]

20. What a waste of our tax dollars, paying dws.

[ReRe]

24. Maybe DWS will get primaried...

... and somehow, Bernie will become the nominee, win the election and appoint a real Democrat to the position of DNC Chair? Well, a girl can dream, can't she?

[leftofcool]

25. What does DWS have to do with the Florida House and Senate that make Florida laws?

[rhett o rick]

45. How do you feel about Clinton's none empathetic postion

on denying medical marijuana to those suffering? I am guessing you are just ok with it.

[HooptieWagon]

53. DWS and Bill Nelson control the party in Florida.

Both are RW Democrats...DWS even has called Republicans her friends and endorsed them.

[truedelphi]

26. If you don't like DWS and what you think she did in Florida, be assured that

Obama and his rat boys over at FBI and DOJ were just as tough on people here in California.

On Sept 27th 2012, there were raids conducted on 36 households in an impoverished neighborhood in Santa Rosa. Parents were thrown to the ground; loaded up in vans, little kids left crying on the curb.

The offense - pot growing in the backyards.

Every 39 minutes there is someone in the state of California being arrested for pot.

However, since the late Congressional session that bans the use of Federal monies to do pot arrests, it is only local police right now that can do this.

Our local paper, The Record Bee, had this police "hero worshiping" article written up maybe two weeks ago. The brave cops went out to the homes of some forty people on parole and arrested those found in violation of their parole regulations.

Boy do I ever feel safe, especially when reading about the 2 fifty somethings who were hauled back to jail for having "paraphernalia."

[Warren DeMontague]

29. One difference is, Melinda Haag retired and they can't find juries out west that will convict

I understand frustration with Obama but I do believe he stood up to some serious institutional inertia on the drug war, particularly in Nov. of 2012 when WA and CO legalized.

As for your point about "the late Congressional session that bans the use of Federal monies to do pot arrests"- you are correct, sort of- the congressional action tells the DEA and DOJ to respect state medical marijuana laws.

...and one person who voted AGAINST that in the house was Debbie Wasserman Schultz.

[truedelphi]

33. Oh for Pete's sake, as President, all he had to do was remove Eric Holder and replace him

With someone who was liberal on the marijuana issue and who would reschedule it.

It is hard to hear someone offering Obama the excuse of him being surrounded by "serious institutional inertia on the drug war, " when he was the man who could get rid of Holder!

[Warren DeMontague]

35. Obama is retiring.

I think he moved the ball forward on the drug war, and frankly had Hillary Clinton been in the White House I question whether CO and WA would have been handled the way they were.

[truedelphi]

41. Where did he move the ball forward? Possibly he did so in CO and in WA,

but far too many marijuana activists are spending time in prison, even as you state so blithely that "juries out west don't convict."

And the reason for the lack of pot convictions in the state of Colorado is not that Obama suddenly became all nice-y nice-y about the marijuana issue. Instead, it has to do with how Colorado passed laws that provided for meticulous state oversight of the stores and cultivators, which apparently satisfied the US government.

From an article over at TheSacramento Bee,
link** http://www.sacbee.com/news/state/california/california-weed/article2589267.html
As one California business man who was convicted of felonies relating to his dispensary activity, he also blames his fate on California legislators’ failure to set clear rules for a medical marijuana industry that mushroomed to more than $1 billion in taxable marijuana sales by 2010. In contrast, Colorado passed laws that provided meticulous state oversight of marijuana stores and cultivators, apparently satisfying the U.S. government, which sharply curtailed prosecutions of marijuana businesses there.

“Our state happily took $100 million in tax money” from medical marijuana business in California, “but when the time came to help us out, they were never to be found,” Davies said in a recent interview at his accountant’s office in Stockton. “If California had the gumption to remove the ambiguities of our law, there is no way a federal prosecutor would have been able to prosecute me.”

Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/news/state/california/california-weed/article2589267.html#storylink=cpy

[Warren DeMontague]

42. I happen to think Obama has done more to end pot prohibition than any previous POTUS.

Even if that's just using the bully pulpit to say what scientists have known for a long time, namely it's not nearly as dangerous as alcohol, by pretty much any yardstick. And admitting he smoked it, and it didn't destroy his brain. (clearly)

But if you want me to defend the raids in CA, I'm not going to do it. I've supported legalization for years, and I believe more than ever that it's the right way to go. And you are correct, CO had a much more rigorous system in place as opposed to the loosey-goosey deal CA set up back in '96 with prop. 215. (although I've always had a sneaking suspicion that CO's status as a swing state was at least an ancillary player) But now they've -CA that is- updated their law, and hopefully they'll fully legalize in November anyway, so it will become moot.

However, this thread- specifically, the topic of this thread- has to do with the track record of the current head of the DNC, who not only voted against prohibiting the feds from interfering with state med. marijuana laws and patients, but also actively worked to defeat a medical marijuana initiative in Florida in 2014, and not too coincidentally the story in the OP is about a woman who arguably is a medical marijuana patient, facing 10 years for growing pot in her own house in Florida, also in 2014.

Also, contrary to what some people who have wandered in here from the greatest page seem to think (damn, that's gotta be a first) this thread doesn't have anything to do with the primaries OR DWS's track record around Bernie Sanders. She had the medical marijuana establishment in Florida well and pissed off at her long before he announced his run.


It's pretty simple and straightforward.

[rhett o rick]

46. Where have you been? Calif has long ago legalized medical marijuana.

And yet Obama/Holder spent their resources on arresting medical marijuana dispensers in Calif. I ask you WHY?

[Warren DeMontague]

48. Like I said, I'm not defending that. Nor am I interested in defending it.

I was seriously disappointed that the raids continued after Obama took office in his 1st term, despite promising they wouldn't.

But I think the landscape changed in 2012, and has continued to.

[scscholar]

27. But in his 45 years in politics...

Bernie hasn't done anything for us either. This issue isn't a differentiator.

[Warren DeMontague]

32. This thread isn't about Bernie Sanders, it's about Debbie Wasserman Schultz's record.

Specifically her voting and advocacy record. You can either try and defend it, or lamely try and change the subject.

[mikehiggins]

38. Who is this "us" you speak of? eom

[eridani]

54. Unlike Clinton, he thinks that cannabis should be descheduled n/t

[1StrongBlackMan]

28. That's just today's reason; but, to the story

is twenty plants a more or fewer plants than allowed in the states that allow people to grow their own medicinal marijuana?

[Warren DeMontague]

30. I think it depends on the state.

In Oregon any household can grow 4, period. But 20 sure as shit isn't gonna get someone 10 years in prison.

Also, "just today's reason"- says who? I've been pretty fucking consistent on it. But here's a glaring example of some real world fallout from her stance on Florida's MMJ initiative in 2014.

10 years for 20 plants, yes, also someone with a medical recommendation from another state, no criminal record, not doing anything violent or even disturbing the peace, who was followed home from a gardening shop.

I suspect the real "today's reason" is you trying to figure out a justification for some shit that under normal circumstances you would immediately recognize as reprehensibly draconian, because you feel your "team" is being attacked.

[1StrongBlackMan]

39. I hear ...

I suspect the real "today's reason" is you trying to figure out a justification for some shit that under normal circumstances you would immediately recognize as reprehensibly draconian, because you feel your "team" is being attacked.

Smoking Marijuana causes paranoid delusions.

[Warren DeMontague]

40. Right, well, maybe the cannabis group isn't the place to take lame stoner shots

instead of having an actual intellectual discussion, assuming one is capable of such a thing.

10 years, no prior convictions, followed home from the gardening shop. Seems reasonable to you?

[rhett o rick]

49. The point here is that Obama went out of his way to prosecute

and give long prison sentences to people dispensing medical marijuana in states that have approved it. Why? Same as Hillary, no empathy for those suffering from conditions like cancer. Big Pharma don't like medical marijuana so Obama and Clinton bow before them.

[Warren DeMontague]

50. Hmmmm, you know, this story seems to get more interesting the more one looks at it.

If you google Ms. Kirouac's name, it becomes apparent that a couple months prior to her arrest, she publicly RSVP'd to a "yes on #2" event, #2 being the Florida medical marijuana initiative in question.

Which causes a couple things to spring immediately to my mind. One, it bolsters her claim to be involved with medical marijuana as a an issue and as a patient, AND it further ties this case to the specific law Debbie Wasserman Schultz and Sheldon Adelson fought to keep from passing.

Beyond that, one hopes that the Florida Medical Marijuana community will be throwing together a well-funded legal defense for Ms. Kirouac, because the immediate question which comes to my mind in a legal context is, (particularly given the cops' statement "there was suspicion she was growing marijuana" and the odd, sort of random nature of an arrest due to 'following her home from the grow shop') --- were the authorities there targeting her specifically due to her participation in political speech and activities protected by the 1st Amendment?

Hmmmmmm.

[merrily]

51. You should never shut up about any politician's record.

[Warren DeMontague]

52. I just find it appalling. Hastert gets 15 months for abusing children, they want to put this woman

away for a decade.

Leaving aside the moral considerations (which are, obviously, considerable) the taxpayers of Florida are going to take her out of her own home, and will need to house her, feed her, provide her medical care... for what? I would think that would piss off even your hard-core conservative types.

Of course, this is the same state that put the guy in the wheelchair away for 25 years, for managing his own spinal pain since he was "taking too many pills"... and then had to turn around and pay to give him morphine in prison, because... yeah, pain patient.

Anyway, it's absurd. There's zero evidence she's a danger to anyone except maybe aphids, if she's a proficient gardener.

[Buzz cook]

55. If the Obama administration had remove pot from scheduled one

We wouldn't be talking about this. Wasserman is a drone not a mover and shaker.

[Warren DeMontague]

56. Obama hasn't been perfect, but as we are constantly reminded, most marijuana law enforcement takes

place on a state level.

This woman was charged under state law. Which could have been changed, and DWS actively worked to prevent it from being changed. Hell, apparently this woman was active in TRYING to get that state referendum passed (hmmmm) ...

Removing it from Schedule one would not have changed the state law around the plant.

One place where Federal Law WOULD be relevant, was the referendum passed directing the DOJ and DEA to respect state-level medical marijuana laws. Which DWS also voted against.

You can draw a direct and very real connection between DWS working to defeat Florida's 2014 medical marijuana reform and this medical marijuana patient being arrested for pot in 2014.

[Buzz cook]

58. Federal law always has precedence over state and local.

But to your point Wasserman has even less control over state law.

[Warren DeMontague]

59. She actively campaigned against the initiative, along with Sheldon Adelson. It is public record.

She's not responsible for her own positions and advocacy?

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/on-medical-marijuana-debbie-wasserman-schultz-sounds-like-a-republican-6544176

South Florida Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schutlz may be chairwoman of the Democratic National Committee, but when it comes to medical marijuana she sure sounds like a Republican.

Wasserman Schultz aired her "concerns" today about the ballot initiative that would legalize medical marijuana in Florida by claiming that it may be "written too broadly." Instead she favors the use of low-dose, non-smokeable THC medications to treat a more limited range of conditions.

(emphasis added)

And if "Federal law takes precedence over state law", then why is Hillary's talking point about the "states being the laboratories of democracy" anything more than meaningless gibberish? Federal law has marijuana illegal, that applies both to the 4 states that have legalized for recreational use as well as the approximately HALF, now, that have legalized medical.

All the more reason for her to display real leadership and deschedule it entirely, remove it from the CSA as sanders has proposed.

But again, this woman is facing charges- and 10 years in prison, again- under state law. A state law that could have been fixed, and DWS worked to make sure it wasn't.

[Buzz cook]

61. I didn't say she wasn't an asshat

I said she had hardly any real power, especially compared with the president.

[Warren DeMontague]

63. Obama could have done more, and particularly in his 1st term he was disappointing on the issue

but that right there is all the more reason why I think we're overdue for some more leadership on this. I think Obama moved the ball forward and helped the conversation in some crucial ways, and I blame some of his administration's missteps and excesses on some pretty serious instititutional inertia.

That said, we should move forward, not back. I want our next POTUS to lead, and since I think I know who our nominee is going to be (and hopefully the next President) my exhortations are to her to listen to the sane, forward-thinking voices on this issue and do so.

[Warren DeMontague]

57. also by "remove from schedule one" do you mean Deschedule it entirely, as Sanders has proposed?

Because frankly HRC's plan to move it from Schedule I to II wouldn't do diddly to reconcile either the conflict between federal and state law (the states where it is legal, that is) OR protect medical marijuana patients from arrest.

[Buzz cook]

60. I would decriminalize on the federal level.

And let the states decide what none criminal, legal regulations they want on it.

I oppose federal legalization because I don't want RJ Reynolds or any other large corporation involved in the process.

[Warren DeMontague]

62. I would hope we can all agree that no one is served by sticking this 50 yr old woman, a known

medical marijuana patient, with no criminal record- in prison for 10 years, because she had some plants in her house.

RJ reynolds, she aint.

But my point about DWS is valid, in that she campaigned against a State initiative which conceivably could have protected this woman from what I believe, at least, is an absurd legal overreach.

[jomin41]

66. I hope we can agree that

There has NEVER been a legitimate reason to make cannabis illegal in any way, period.

[B Calm]

69. DWS needs to be voted out of office!

[Warren DeMontague]

70. I agree.

I'm supporting Tim Canova. I know it's a long shot, but... the fact that DWS allied herself with Sheldon Adelson to kill MMJ reform last time around in Florida.... Pretty bad.