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What's Ableism? (Original Post) snooper2 Feb 2012 OP
It is discrimination against people with disabilities MadrasT Feb 2012 #1
I think it's an issue that started with Cain JNelson6563 Feb 2012 #2
its being biased against the disabled. La Lioness Priyanka Feb 2012 #3
"Ableism is that set of often contradictory thucythucy Feb 2012 #4
Beat me to it -- VERY good post obamanut2012 Feb 2012 #5
Disabled women are very often left out thucythucy Feb 2012 #7
Interesting! I have to see if the library has it obamanut2012 Feb 2012 #8
Thanks..very much so. snooper2 Feb 2012 #6
yes lots of work to do regarding all the isms. unapatriciated Feb 2012 #10
Very informative. Rex Feb 2012 #9
Does this include mental illness? Neoma Feb 2012 #11
It must. Rex Feb 2012 #12
I would almost say it needs a category of its own. Neoma Feb 2012 #13
IMO, if a mental illness becomes a disability Rex Feb 2012 #14
I would say yes. thucythucy Feb 2012 #15
You're going to have to clear that up for me. Neoma Feb 2012 #16
I'm sorry for being unclear. thucythucy Feb 2012 #17

MadrasT

(7,237 posts)
1. It is discrimination against people with disabilities
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 09:31 AM
Feb 2012

I have mostly heard it used in the realm of physical disabilities. As in, favoritism of "able-bodied" people.

thucythucy

(8,742 posts)
4. "Ableism is that set of often contradictory
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 10:16 AM
Feb 2012

stereotypes about people with disabilities that acts as a barrier to keep them from achieving their full potential as equal citizens in society. Among these are beliefs that people with disabilities are inherently unable to manage their own lives, that they are embittered and malevolent, and that they are, by reason of their disability, morally, intellectually, and spiritually inferior to temporarily able-bodied people, or, conversely, that people with disabilities are saintlike, ever cheerful, asexual, childlike, and unusually heroic. Ultimately, it is the belief that people with disabilities are different from "normal" people, and that their lives are inherently less worthwhile than those of people without disabilities. It is the 'ism' at the root of discrimination against people with disabilities on the job, in school, and in the community.

Ableism can be subtle, as when a bus driver radios his dispatcher that he has just picked up 'a wheelchair,' meaning someone who uses a wheelchair for mobility. Or it can be overt, as when a Myrtle Beach, South Carolina motel in 1995 refused to allow two women with cerebral palsy to rent rooms. Pushed to its ultimate extreme it can result in violence as in March 1989 when a group of youths gang-raped a developmentally disabled woman in Glen Ridge, New Jersey. Ableism in Nazi Germany led to the murder of hundreds of thousands of people with disabilities...."
from The ABC-CLIO Companion to The Disability Rights Movement, by Fred Pelka, 1997.


Among the other examples Pelka gives of ableism is this quote from the head of the Spastic Society of Britain, who dismissed the idea that someone with spasticity would ever be able to manage the Society. "That'd be like putting dogs and cats in charge of the Humane Society." Another example I've seen is when people explain that people are disabled because they've sinned, or have bad karma, or their parents have sinned, or God is punishing them for the sins of the entire community. Then there are all those popular culture depictions of people with disabilities as evil, weird, bitter. Think of Dr. Strangelove, Captain Ahab, Captain Hook, etc. It used to be any time you saw someone with a disability in the movies or on TV, he or she was inevitably a villian. These attitudes remain among many people, just under the surface.

Aside from Pelka's books (his latest is, "What We Have Done: An Oral History of the Disability Rights Movement&quot you might want to check out Joe Shapiro, "No Pity," and the PBS Documentary "Lives Worth Living." There's also a really excellent, though slightly dated documentary "When Billy Broke His Head" that includes a quite excellent introduction to the concept.

Hope this is helpful

obamanut2012

(27,802 posts)
5. Beat me to it -- VERY good post
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 10:19 AM
Feb 2012

And something to think about. Disabled women, especially women who are developmentally disabled, are usually left out of this conversation, I think.

thucythucy

(8,742 posts)
7. Disabled women are very often left out
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 11:53 AM
Feb 2012

as you point out.

One of my favorite books on this topic is With Wings: An Anthology of Literature By and About Women with Disabilities, edited by Marsha Saxton and Florence Howe.

Best wishes (and Obama/Biden in 2012!).

obamanut2012

(27,802 posts)
8. Interesting! I have to see if the library has it
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 12:18 PM
Feb 2012

And, best wishes to you, too, and to a very blue election season.

 

snooper2

(30,151 posts)
6. Thanks..very much so.
Wed Feb 22, 2012, 10:38 AM
Feb 2012

I thought we have evolved quite a bit since the 50's in this regard but there are always work to do.

unapatriciated

(5,390 posts)
10. yes lots of work to do regarding all the isms.
Fri Feb 24, 2012, 06:15 AM
Feb 2012

If we join together we can and will make a huge dent in them.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
14. IMO, if a mental illness becomes a disability
Sat Feb 25, 2012, 02:56 PM
Feb 2012

Last edited Sun Feb 26, 2012, 01:49 AM - Edit history (1)

and someone discriminates against me based on what I have no control over...although I can see there being levels to what is and is not discrimination. It is a very complex issue.

thucythucy

(8,742 posts)
15. I would say yes.
Sat Feb 25, 2012, 03:06 PM
Feb 2012

The caveat would be that there are some in the psychiatric survivor community who don't believe there is such a thing as "mental illness"--that unless you're talking about a specific injury to the brain, most if not all of what society commonly terms "mental illness" is actually a reaction to societal stresses--for instance, post traumatic stress disorder, which is a response to physical violence, or sexual abuse, which are social, not individual problems. They see the medicalization of "mental illness"--and the widespread use of psychiatric drugs--as a way to cover over issues like poverty, domestic violence, war, racism, sexism, homophobia, all of which cause individuals to respond in ways our society would rather label "mental illness"--as opposed to dealing with the root causes of these individual responses. For example, they would say that the widepread incidence of "depression" in our culture is a response to the various social ills we face over which individuals are trained to feel they have no control, and thus end up feeling disempowered and "depressed." Rather than drug the population, (and feed the coffers of the health care industry) they would say a better response would be for people to organize politically to address these issues, thus feeling more empowered, less "depressed."

One illustration of what I mean is how homosexuality used to be considered a form of "mental illness." It wasn't until the gay rights movement challenged the psychiatric establishment that this definition was changed. True, gay people in prior times (and now) were perhaps more likely to feel depressed, suicidal, etc.--but that was a response to the shitty way they were treated by society, not something inherent in being gay. Thomas Szasz wrote a book called "The Myth of Mental Illness" that lays out some of this, there's lots of other literature along the same lines.

This is not a consensus view, and there's quite a lot of diversity in the psychiatric survivor movement. Some people do believe in "mental illness" as an objective fact and not simply (!) a social construct. They still however advocate for more humane treatment of people labeled "mentally ill" and an end to stereotypes and bigotry that people with mental illness often face, which yes, is another form of "ableism."

Check out Judi Chamberlin's book "On Our Own" which talks about responses to "mental illness" that are community/peer based, as opposed to being delivered by the medical-pharmaceutical complex. Also, "The Madness Network News Reader" is a really good basic text on the psychiatric survivor movement. These are both kind of dated, but still good stuff. You can also go to the MindFreedom International website (easy to find on Google) for more info.

Sorry for the longwinded answer, but it's sort of a complicated question.

Best wishes.

Neoma

(10,039 posts)
16. You're going to have to clear that up for me.
Sat Feb 25, 2012, 03:41 PM
Feb 2012
"Some people do believe in "mental illness" as an objective fact and not simply (!) a social construct. They still however advocate for more humane treatment of people labeled "mentally ill" and an end to stereotypes and bigotry that people with mental illness often face, which yes, is another form of "ableism."


It looks like you're trying to say that having a mental illness only has to do with environmental factors. And that people trying to end the bigotry and stereotypes are being ableists.

Maybe I read that wrong, but that's what it looks like.

thucythucy

(8,742 posts)
17. I'm sorry for being unclear.
Sat Feb 25, 2012, 05:14 PM
Feb 2012

There are some people who insist that most of what is labeled "mental illness" is indeed a social construct. Such people still favor ending discrimination and abuse of people labeled mentally ill, no matter what the cause of the alleged illness. In fact, some of the most vocal critics of the idea of "mental illness" are also the most politically active in fighting discrimination directed at people who have to live with the labels. And so fighting to end discrimination and abuse wouldn't be "ableism" at all.

"Ableism" would be, for example, denying someone a job for which they were qualified simply because that person had been diagnosed with a mental illness. Or assuming that all people labeled mentally ill are dangerous, deviant, violent, etc.

Personally, I think there are some forms of mental illness that exist apart from purely social factors. But it's an ongoing debate within the psychiatric survivor community whether this is true or not. Even so, I think anyone in the movement would say discrimination is bad, and that the stereotyping of people labeled as mentally ill is indeed a form of ableism.

I hope that clears it up some.

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