2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumHow many votes for Trump were more of a vote *FOR* Clinton?
Because by now, we know how those motherfuckers did this.
And we know they stole this from her.
scscholar
(2,902 posts)How is a vote for rump a vote for Clinton?
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)We now know there was interference.
Chernobyl
(42 posts)all hell would break loose. If you've got details, please feel free to share with the rest of the class. As of now nobody has indicated that took place.
dflprincess
(28,459 posts)No one has ever admitted that Florida was stolen with the help of rigged machines in 2000.
And it does seem just a tad odd that Hillary lost the "too close to call" areas where there was no paper backup.
I have no doubt this one of those things the PTB are being quiet about "for the good of the country". Because in the U.S. it is far more important to pretend we have free and fair elections than to actually have free and fair elections.
Chernobyl
(42 posts)judge in this country who spends countless hours making sure that our elections are fair and not rigged.
dflprincess
(28,459 posts)or programmed to "miscount" votes?
pnwmom
(109,535 posts)for cellular connectivity in the optical scanners used by half the states was taken advantage of by the hackers.
http://www.mediapost.com/publications/article/291179/investigators-find-security-flaws-in-wisconsin-vot.html
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)You place great faith in humanity's inerrant and unfailing ability to be both inerrant and unfailing.
kenfrequed
(7,865 posts)And it is contradicted by tons of studies by university computer and security experts.
The fact of the matter is that the election probably was tampered with by the GOP as usual. Diebold just changed it's name. They still service those same flawed machines, particularly in the south.
John Conyers actually held a committee about what happened in Ohio in 2004 and there was significant evidence of the Republicans engaging in voter suppression, questionable voting machines, limiting access, and knocking people off the rolls.
But we never go after the Republicans for any of this because the Democratic party is desperately afraid of being labeled as conspiracy nuts or as sore losers.
Greg Palast did an excellent job both in reviewing the 2000 election and the 2016 election. Crosscheck was the new and improved version of Choicepoint. What is past is prologue in this case I suppose. The voter rolls were purged of people that had names that sounded vaguely black or ethnic. The mainstream press and the mainstream Democrats were utterly silent.
The media seems to only be fixated on Russia for some stupid reason when the real threat was there all along. Palast covered Crosscheck months ago, hell years ago he pointed out this kind of thing and we did nothing. The criminals of voter suppression have always been republicans and this time around is no exception.
ElementaryPenguin
(7,838 posts)The infamous "Hursti Hack" (but no so famous that the mainstream media feels compelled to ever mention it)
Of course, now we're venturing towards those darned "CONSPIRACY THEORIES" - AKA the easiest way to invalidate a valid accusation!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volusia_error
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hursti_Hack
triron
(22,240 posts)guillaumeb
(42,649 posts)mythology
(9,527 posts)The sort of inane conspiracy nonsense never has any evidence. They can't explain how Michigan with paper ballots demographically matched other states. They can't explain how Wisconsin with the chair and vice chair of the election commission being Democrats also participated in the conspiracy. They can't explain how such a thing manages to stay quiet.
It's a lot like those who deny climate change, evolution and the moon landing. The evidence being against them is just part of the conspiracy.
triron
(22,240 posts)There is enough evidence to convince me.
Maybe not you.
Chernobyl
(42 posts)hacked into our election system, altered votes, changed vote tallies or anything like that. If you've got evidence that anyone, including Russia did anything like that I would personally love to see it because that sure would make all of this a lot easier. The cold hard truth is that people voted for Trump, whether they did so from an educated point of view or not is in question. There's been no evidence whatsoever released that shows or even hints around that the election was actually "hacked".
At this point the only thing that's been insinuated is that Russia "infiltrated" our election by stealing and publishing emails from the DNC and John Podesta and/or they put out fake news stories that duped people into voting for Trump. Until we all realize what actually took place we'll never make any progress in fixing what took place. On a national level we were beaten badly, on a state level we didn't make up enough ground to make a difference this time around and 2018 is going to be even more difficult based on who is up for election and which states they're in.
If we intend on regaining power in any way we need to stop crying about Russians hiding in our closets and voting booths and start worrying about getting more people to vote for Democrats.
triron
(22,240 posts)the reported vote show an incredible likelihood that votes (that people thought they cast for Clinton) either did not get counted or were switched to Trump. The odds were astronomical that this happened. Then cyber experts also urged the Clinton campaign to ask for recounts in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania because they noticed peculiar behavior of the relative vote tabulations in precincts where vote machines were used vs not. I will not go into detail about the obstacles that were thrown up against fair recounts in those states. There were findings of possible cellular connectivity in tabulation machines.
Then there were numerous other incongruities such as pre-election polling, pre-election betting predictions, DU going down Nov 8, Rudy Giuliani telling Fox news 2 weeks before the election that 'they' had a few things up their sleeves.
I'm sure I missed a few.
uppityperson
(115,844 posts)Response to uppityperson (Reply #25)
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uppityperson
(115,844 posts)Response to uppityperson (Reply #31)
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synergie
(1,901 posts)Actually, people have been wondering, especially when the machines in Detroit and certain counties in WI were not investigated.
Shall the class explain to you that when you are denied an investigation, that it's a bit difficult to come up with details?
AgadorSparticus
(7,963 posts)They used.
scscholar
(2,902 posts)AgadorSparticus
(7,963 posts)For example, every 5 votes for x we count only 4 and for every 5 votes for y, we add 1. So, it is not a matter of just adding 1. It could be, though. But who knows? Do you?
True_Blue
(3,063 posts)And I wonder if any illegal Russian immigrants "poured across the border" to vote for Trump?
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)None were needed to pour across the border if they could just tweak a couple counties.
But please proceed.
True_Blue
(3,063 posts)I'm not marginalizing this issue. I actually agree with you and always appreciate your threads. But everything Trump has said so far has been pure projection, so his statement "Mexicans pouring across the border" is just something that keeps troubling me.
I think there many ways they stole the election like flipping votes, voter supression, disenfranchisement...etc.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)That...and the media reporting it as a fact.
I suspect much of our MSM has been infiltrated by Putin as well.
triron
(22,240 posts)wasn't needed with other forms of disenfranchisement (including voter suppression).
LisaM
(28,564 posts)It has become much harder to vote in places like Milwaukee and Detroit. In fact, in Detroit, they were begging for new equipment that the state wouldn't provide.
mtnsnake
(22,236 posts)We know that the Russians interfered with the election by hacking into DNC emails and releasing those emails that would be embarrassing for our campaign and cost us votes. However, no one but you and a few other conspiracy theorists has any proof that the voting machines were tampered with or hacked into to "switch" votes, even though you insist here and in other threads that this was done and you even "know how those motherfuckers did this."
It's one thing to speculate that they hacked into the machines, but it's another to say you know how they did it when you don't. The significance would be monumental if you really do know how they did it because the outcome of the election would at least be nullified, if not reversed.
So, if you "know how those motherfuckers did this," how about enlightening everyone including the CIA, and tell us exactly "how" they did it, along with the information you have that proves it so we can get the election overturned.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)It would take quiet an effort to hack voting machines around the country, and someone would squeal or leave a trail.
I really think we are looking like Birther GOPers with some of the accusations recently. If the accusations pan out, great. But most of this stuff evaporates within a few days and we move on to the next conspiracy theory. And I don't care if GOPers did it. I have no desire to be like a GOPer.
Response to mtnsnake (Reply #23)
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triron
(22,240 posts)are still trying to "frame the narrative", Laydeebug.