If the recount does reveal hacking, we will never be allowed to know.

[musicblind]

I'm watching Oliver Stone's Untold History of the United States.

I'm about 9 episodes in and one thing that stands out, over and over, is just how 'in the dark' most American citizens are kept... intentionally.

Whether it's over Nixon's bombings in Cambodia, JBL lying about death tolls in Vietnam, the Japanese government's willingness to surrender before the Atom Bomb was dropped, or just how close we came to nuclear war under Eisenhower's communication breakdown, JFK's health Addison's disease and drug addiction... the prevailing thought seemed to be: "Yes, this is bad, but it will be worse if the citizens know. They can't handle it. So, they can't know."

If it turned out that the recount exposed a fatal hack, one that could reverse the results and call our election's into question on a global scale... they would never allow the people to know.

They would reason that America is now starting to accept a Trump presidency, and letting Trump maintain the presidency would cause less damage that:

An international lack of faith in American democracy.

A potential Civil War that could kill millions.

A potential war with Russia.

The fall from grace of some of our nation's most prominent plutocrats.

Make no mistake, they would see Trump's presidency as a disaster, and they would act swiftly behind the scenes to fix this before the next election, but they would never let us know what is going on.

The past is prologue. They didn't trust the American people in the past and they wouldn't trust us now.

This is not to say that I don't support the recount. I do. I even donated. I'm just pointing out this sad reality.

[MADem]

1. Oliver Stone is the left's Alex Jones.

Someone in Germany, France or UK just might get the scoop and pass it on if no one here does.

The reason that "EWWWWWWW ASSANGE!!!!!!" and "GASP!!!!! SNOWDEN!!!" didn't get much traction or bring down the House of Obama is because, aside from the fact that they are both useful tools of Vladimir Putin and are both being funded and/or protected by him, is because we all spy on each other. We all know it. We just don't SAY we know it. One or more of our allies probably has a damned good idea of what's going on in USA.

I can't tell you how many times I've had to boot allies out of NOFORN briefs. If I actually thought I was preventing them from finding out the trajectory of the conversation, I'd have called myself a fool--but conventions must be upheld.

[musicblind]

7. I never thought of Oliver Stone that way.

But I guess, looking at him from an outside perspective, I can see how people might get that.

I don't think his Untold History documentary is too over the top, but if he is unreliable then I will certainly seek out more information and not rely on it as a source.

What are NOFORN brief? Do you work in government?

[MADem]

10. He always goes beyond the known into speculation that is often wild.

Some stuff is worse than others. I just don't consider him reliable or unimpeachable. I think he spins a helluva yarn, though.

NOFORN is what it sounds like--no foreigners! It's material that is not authorized for dissemination to foreign nationals.

I'm retired from military service.

[ancianita]

8. Nope. I've been alive during the times Stone makes movies about. He doesn't lie.

Or twist facts or connect weird random dots to uncover truths about those times.

He's got footage, original documentation, experts -- and has become an historian in his own right.

Alex Jones is an ideologue with a team of rant writers.

[MADem]

9. So have I. My assessment stands. nt

[MichMary]

2. Something I don't understand:

From everything I've heard, neither Michigan's nor Wisconsin's voting machines/optical scanners are on the Internet, so how can they be hacked? Would it be a virus in the software?

I will claim near total ignorance about how these computer machines work! But would really like to know about how the voting could have been hacked without being on the I-net.

[ucrdem]

3. As I understand it the hackery is on the cards used to load the ballots onto each machine.

Each district has its own set of races and measures so each machine has to be loaded via smartcard or floppy to show the local ballot. So whoever produces the smartcards has access to every machine.

[MichMary]

4. So, would each smartcard/floppy have to be

custom-hacked?

[ucrdem]

5. Well each has to have custom software loaded onto it from somebody's PC

so that's probably where the hack would originate. And if the hack is some clever number changer programmed to erase itself on Nov. 9 it could be loaded onto the smartcards without the election workers handling them detecting it. But it's hard to imagine that some local or state officials weren't in the loop. So if a hack is detected somewhere there's a fairly limited group of possible perps.

[MichMary]

6. Thanks for the explanation! n/t