"Sam Harris: I’d vote for ‘dangerously deluded religious imbecile’ Ben Carson over Noam Chomsky"

[Goblinmonger]

Oh, Sam, just because you often make valid points about religion in general and Islam specifically, doesn't mean that everything that comes out of your mouth makes sense. This is a prime example:

“The Republicans are right to be completely outraged by this — and they’re completely crazy,” Harris explained.”This is a terrible situation to be in politically.”

“Take the personalities of the people on the right out of the equation. Is it crazy to express, as Ted Cruz did, a preference for Christians over Muslims in this process?” Harris asked. “Of course not. What percentage of Christians will be jihadists or want to live under Sharia law? Zero. And this is a massive, in fact the only, concern when talking about security. We know that some percentage of Muslims will be jihadists inevitably… So it is not mere bigotry or mere xenophobia to express that preference. I hope you understand that I am expressing no sympathy at all with Ted Cruz’s politics or with Ted Cruz. But it is totally unhelpful to treat him — though he actually is a religious maniac — like a bigot on this point. This is a quite reasonable concern to voice.”

For fuck's sake, Sam, voting for Cruz or liking basically any idea that comes from that pea-sized brain is ridiculous. How do you not know that?

And then this gem:

“Given a choice between Noam Chomsky and Ben Carson, in terms of the totality of their understanding of what’s happening now in the world, I’d vote for Ben Carson every time,” Harris stated. “Ben Carson is a dangerously deluded religious imbecile, Ben Carson does not…the fact that he is a candidate for president is a scandal…but at the very least he can be counted on to sort of get this one right. He understands that jihadists are the enemy.”

I realize a lot of this is tainted by the giant grammar nerd that I am, but I would chose Chomsky over Harris damn near every time on damn near every issue.

If this guy were my pope, I'd have to fire him.

Full article Though I really hate giving RawStory any clicks.

[arcane1]

1. He seems to be one of those people who are unaware that jihad is a reaction.

Many fail to realize they're pissed off at us because we've been fucking with their countries for a century.

[onager]

5. A lot more to it than that.

Let's not forget the tendency for Middle Eastern despots to seek help from the most fanatical of their followers, then try to throw those same followers under the bus once they seize power. No Western imperialism required.

Saudi Arabia is a prime example. When Abdul Aziz bin Saud was trying to take over the country, he allied with the Ikhwan Army; a/k/a "The White Terror," who thought Saud and his Wahhabis were just too liberal on religion. They wanted a REAL Islamic govt., with them in charge.

That was a close call. Saud finally defeated them with machine guns helpfully provided by the British. Who weren't much inclined to help him, since Saud had totally screwed up their plans to take over the Arabian peninsula and install their own puppet (as they did with the Hashemite rulers in Jordan and Iraq). It was also helpful that the Ikhwan Army seems to have learned their tactics from Gen. Haig in WWI - get on line and bravely charge the machine guns until all of you are dead.

Nasser did the same thing with Hassan al-Banna and the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. They forged an alliance to kick out the British. When al-Banna realized Nasser wasn't going to establish a "pure" Islamic Republic of Egypt after the 1952 Revolution, the Brotherhood tried to take over the govt. Al-Banna was executed.

Weirdly, his brother Gamal al-Banna was the exact opposite - a liberal Muslim who fought his whole life for separation of mosque and state. And a staunch feminist. He died in 2013 at the age of 92.

[arcane1]

7. Thanks for the larger perspective!

[AlbertCat]

2. IF..... IF refugees become radicalize over here...

.... it will be because of the way we treat them.

The vetting process isn't perfect, but it's quite a few hoops to jump thru. 1st off... refugees don't get to pick the country they go to. And it gets harder from there.

Harris is being ridiculous.

[mr blur]

3. Well for a start Ted Cruz would certainly want to live under theocratic law,

it's just a case of which dangerous delusion you choose to allow to control things.

That said, much as I despise religion as much as he does, Harris is still a dumb fuck, sometimes.

[mountain grammy]

4. Really ignorant thing to say. Impossible to argue with that level of nonsense.

[Lordquinton]

6. I think the real takeaway here

Is that Harris can recognize "good" aspects in people while acknowledging the bad. Now he just needs to learn what's really good and bad...

[PassingFair]

8. I haven't like Sam Harris since the Gulf War...

For an atheist, he is remarkably one-sided.

[Promethean]

9. I dislike Harris' approach here

because he is giving extremist nutjobs credit where raw bigotry simply led them kinda sorta in the right direction. There are plenty of reasons to be opposed to muslim immigration than bigotry. Everywhere in Europe that has had a significant amount of muslim immigration there have been problems. Not racist clashing but culture clashes where the muslims are very clearly in the wrong. The most glaring example has been in the Scandinavian countries. Rape has been escalating dramatically and the increase is at the hands of muslim men raping non-muslim women. They see all these women who aren't covering up "properly" and who aren't part of the ummah so they come to the conclusion that these women are free to "take." Problems like this are happening all over. There are periodic stories of honor killings in the UK. FGM is increasing all over Europe. People are seeing this and seeing who is doing it and are coming to the perfectly reasonable conclusion that muslim culture is not compatible with their own.

There is a British pundit who said something that resonates with this issue. I credit him with the spirit of this if not the exact words. We are having all these problems with the muslim immigrants and liberals are all coming out declaring bigotry every time someone speaks out about it. Its killing the necessary conversation to fix the problems and it is going to cost the liberals politically in the long run. People are going to get fed up and side with the people who have been proclaiming the muslims are evil from the start.

[beam me up scottie]

10. "If this guy were my pope, I'd have to fire him."

Word.

I'm not a Harris fan but even I'm floored by this.

[Curmudgeoness]

11. Thank god we have no popes in A&A.

Harris can be an intelligent, articulate atheist, but he often steps out of his expertise. This is one of those times. I can't imagine what he is thinking when he would be willing to have a whack job of a religious zealot in a position of power.

[Yorktown]

12. Sam harris is often wrong, but also makes some very good points

After all, I have to bow to the clear cut sentences you report:

Ted Cruz .. is a religious maniac

Ben Carson is a dangerously deluded religious imbecile

But Harris can be dead wrong too. His attitude on torture comes to mind.

However, ill expressed as it is here, I see the point Harris is trying to make: he is extremely wary of Islam, and expresses deep concern over angelism about the Syrian refugees issue.

Anyway, and I fear, sadly, the US will have a real life experiment to see how things pan out:
70k refugees out of a 300M population is not much.
One or two million refugees in Germany with an aging population of 80M should be a test.
I'm not too sure it will turn out well. Just the other side of the border, in France, the wars of religion killed 6 times more than WW1 as a % of total population..