The Spirituality of Bees
I went to a talk on this subject Friday night. The presenter of this information was a dear friend of mine. She's been working with honeybees for the last six years and is producing a book full of information from the bees themselves.
The bees we call "worker bees", they call maidens. The bees that modern beekeepers often send to their deaths because they believe there is no purpose for drones? The bees call the drones the holiest of bees. They are allowed into any hive, where they enter the nursery where the baby bees, which the bees call pips, are forming. There, the drones sing the song of life to the baby bees, before they're even born. They sing of their past and their purpose in life.
When my friend Jacqueline asked the bees what they call themselves, a hive or what. They call themselves a Unity.
I'll be alerting you to the progress of how this book is coming and in the meantime, please be sure to watch "Queen of the Sun." My friend Jacqueline is one of the farmers in the documentary.
BlueIris
(29,135 posts)Supposedly, one of the animal totems I have been working with for a few months now is Bee. Which has been interesting. They keep showing up in the oddest places, which around here, is anywhere. Some residents of our fair city claim they haven't seen a honey bee in our area since roughly the year 2000. I've seen two in the last month.
I would love to read this book when it is published.
OneGrassRoot
(23,423 posts)About the experience with bees of late, as well as looking forward to the book.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)And we're interfering with the drones...
I wonder if that has any relationship to Colony Collapse Disorder?
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)And when too many insults have occurred for a Unity of bees to continue and reproduce healthy generations of themselves, they are asked by the overlighting deva of the hive to take themselves out of production. That, from the bees.
It was about a two hour talk and Jacqueline says that's only a 20th of the information she has put together in her book. It's going to be a doozy.
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)Is this meant to be literal? Does the author really claim to know the opinions of bees?
kentauros
(29,414 posts)why you're in our safe haven questioning the things we like to discuss and/or believe in? There's a forum for septics, you know. Go mock us there.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)Lovely typo!
I kinda thought there really was a "septic" group jess fer a second.
Then I saw your post and
We're the "antiseptic" that's sorely needed some days.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)Antiseptic, indeed!
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)and other known spiritual germs
pleasant fragrance
free
kentauros
(29,414 posts)Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)Didja read Robb's post about the bee swarm and his amazing wife saving the whole scene?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1018132003
And this post.
Go bees!
rucognizant
(1,368 posts)Burt got left in the dust. Only his name remains. He lives next town over. A chiock cam eonthe scene na,ed Roxanne Quimby. SH epushed hom out made heaps of money......is now wheeling and deeling woith wolderness aquisition in Maine.
That said, she is giving a generous grant to the Beehive Design Collective, in Machias Me. for a community improvement grant, a large mural in downtown.
What goes around comes around .......or publicity stunt?
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)Was Burt an ok guy? Never researched the company but the products are ubiquitous in my area. Thanks for chiming in with an update.
Peace to all this weekend. Peace...
kentauros
(29,414 posts)It was intentional, though
Sometime last year I got tired of seeing "woo" this and "woo-woo" that and came up with my own countering word for the opposite side. Only instead of an onomatopoeia word, I picked something that was a real word, and had an appropriate definition, especially in its etymology
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)I wondered if it might have been deliberate, it was such a well-placed shot. Well done!
kentauros
(29,414 posts)As is often said on another "active" group at DU: "words have meaning"
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)or anywhere else.
I felt confused by the OP, so I asked about it. We may have different belief systems (I don't really know) but that does not mean we can't try to understand each others point of view. I read threads here on occasion, but I rarely post because I generally understand what is being discussed, such as astrology.
I may be a skeptic, but I have been a member of a major occult group (the O.T.O) for over a decade, and I have never heard of people deciphering the spirituality of insects. My motivation is strictly based in curiosity. I am not going to make fun of any answer I receive, unless it is a personal attack against me. But since the posters here are generally polite, I don't expect that to be a problem.
For what it is worth, I have been mocked in the Skeptic's group on DU2 for being more skeptical than some of the other regulars of that group. I am very skeptical of the inherent existence of groups, values, and meanings, and some DUers think that is silly of me.
All that said, I do understand why you would feel defensive about my questions. Some on DU would mock you. I admit that I may have mocked you years ago, but I no longer feel that is how I want to conduct myself.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)Ultimately it doesn't matter what the author thinks, it matters what the person reading it thinks.
"Truth" and "Reality" are very slippery concepts, so I like the idea of treating absolutely everything, right down to the colour of my eyes, as metaphor.
I think the concept of bees having their own spiritual life is a hell of an evocative idea.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)I am very interested in beliefs. How beliefs are formed, how beliefs are dissolved, and how beliefs affect our decisions.
I am also interested in the sociological aspect of beliefs. What do people really believe, and why? The only way I can answer that question is by asking people what they believe, and why they believe it.
People's relationship to the concept of bee spirituality is what I am interested in.
I generally learn about these types of concepts best by having discussions about them.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)My position is one of radical skepticism. More precisely, it's Pyrrhonian skepticism, named after an ancient Greek philosophical tradition. I actively withhold both belief and disbelief in everything, including even such mundane ideas as "The universe is a real place," or "I am a human being." I would go so far as to say, "I perceive something that seems like a real universe" - except that I don't even have satisfying definitions of the concepts "I" or "perceive" yet.
From that position, the question of bee spirituality is no different than the colour of my eyes or whether (or not) the moon exists.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)Perhaps people would be more honest if we said things were predictable, as opposed to true.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)I don't think I could go further than that any more, though. I spent far too long as a logical positivist. Can't go back there any more. Beliefs tend to be traps. So do disbeliefs. I'm looking for radical moksha, not more subtle traps.
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)The short answer is yes. She is in communication with the bees.
Everything that lives on the farm matters. A couple of days ago, my friend had one of her hives swarm. It was wet and really cold. She had to capture the hive in a bucket, but many bees fell to the sides and down into the wet grass of the orchard. On Friday, my dear friend spent five hours with a feather and a Dixie cup, picking up bees from the grass. She guessed she rescued about 500 bees.
She did that because every bee matters.
I've known Jacqueline for many years. We both follow biodynamic agriculture practices as taught by Rudolph Steiner.
The farm is considered a co-creative effort including plants, animals, insects, the farmer and everything else you can find there.
Our local extension agency, with direction from Washington State University, has been conducting experiments on biodynamic compost. The results are coming in and make for interesting reading.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)It was quite the experience, cooperating with her and asking for her advice, since I'm a total novice with plants. She seemed very happy that I'd taken the time to do that.
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)They are like the repositories of knowledge about their particular subject... plus. There is liveliness, strength and knowledge.
I'm glad you had that experience.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)and if so, do you think everyone should try to connect to their work in a similar way? For example, should a fast food employee try to connect on a religious or spiritual level with certain aspects of his or her job, or are some jobs too toxic for that type of spiritual connection?
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)I remember exactly when it happened for me. I was making the bajillianth meal for my family. I was tired of feeling unappreciated and put out. I was also suffering from the affects of anger via health issues.
In the blink of an eye I had the realization that whatever I'm doing is holy. Every meal I make is a sacrament to myself, life, to my family and others. I began to become conscious of many aspects of my life that I had previously performed as an automaton. I stood there, chopping vegetable, thanking them for giving their life to us. I felt the knife in my hand, my feet on the floor, my heart beating, my breathe moving in and out of my lungs. There was a point where I practiced feeling my blood flowing through every bit of my circulatory system. Becoming conscious of life in everything is the path I follow.
My life has depth and richness that I'd never thought possible before I began to become conscious. I finally began to understand what the gurus meant when they extolled, "Be here now." It took me more than 20 years to get that one.
I've since worked at a number of jobs, including a stint in a factory. I loved the people I worked with. Six Vietnamese men, all ten years older than I. And me, a woman, I was their lead person. I worked that job until I saw the owner of the factory making (in my opinion) some bad business decisions. Not my company, not my business. I wrote a letter on the spot, outlining why I was leaving, but since it was not my place to dictate anything about how the business was run, I was leaving.
I could not support bad decisions (dishonesty) with my time (life). Choice. Supporting a dishonest company just would not do it for me.
I'm sure many people do connect to their work on a spiritual level. We are creatures who make meaning. We build it or discover it in our lives, in whatever manner we do.
Really though, I'd rather talk about bees. My relationship with plants, chickens, bees, supporting them to be the best expression of plants, chickens and bees (unity) possible is the highest level of work for me.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)Spiritually speaking, in your opinion, what are some important lessons humans can learn from bees?
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)both as a group and as part of the whole of the cosmos.
Oh my, that makes me think of Carl Sagan's Cosmos series. What a wonderful example of a human who understood that we're all a part of everything. AND he didn't need any sort of dogma to live a good life, full of wonder.
I changed a typo ~ for some reason, on a regular basis, I drop one of the Os in good and write god, as in "god life." Whenever I do that, I find it interesting to say the least. I certainly don't have a belief in any god in any usual sense. To me, god is a three letter word that allows me to communicate something... sometimes.
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)We have been debased in our society to thinking we should only act/work for $. For me, this is the poisoning of our society. The Biblical quote: "Money is the root of all evil." has a ring of truth in it, as it can take hold of a society, as I believe it has ours.
When we act only out of the desire for $ (or what it buys....material stuff) we are robbed of any true joy & spiritual satisfaction from our actions. When we start focusing on our ACTIONS & how we can derive joy from them, regardless of how insignificant our work may seem, WE make it significant w/the focus we place on it. I have worked many jobs over my 5+ decades on this planet & have found that often those that I got the most fulfillment from were NOT the ones I was paid the most to do.
Always, we CHOOSE to be fulfilled & find meaning in our contributions, regardless of society's view of us.
Imagine if we all connected to our work in a significant & intimate way, how much better our society would be!
There was a book written in the '80's--"Do What You Love & the Money Will Follow". Frankly, this should be our goal. Finding our passion & joy, & $ should be secondary. I believe we all would be much better off in all aspects.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)It comes across as the standard incredulous reaction so often seen by the sceptic crowd. Not "Hmm, what's that all about, I wonder?" but this:
These questions wreak of the utterly sceptical and unbelieving in their wording. It doesn't matter if you didn't mean it that way, because it reads like what I would expect to see as a post in the septics group. And thus, my reaction.
Now, if you're okay with editing your questions to something more agreeable to the things we discuss here and do believe (such as channeling, or "other ways of knowing" then I'll delete my post. Otherwise, it stands, and I know I'm not the only one that thinks this way when approached by known sceptics who are also known for the mocking of our ideas here (whether that took place in the past or recently.)
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)That includes people believing that I will be nice when I post questions in this forum. I don't expect you, or anyone here, to automatically believe that I will be "cool" just because I say so.
Since the hosts have not chosen to block me from this group, I feel they are being very open minded to possibility that I actually won't mock anything I see posted in this group.
I thought my questions were more neutral, but I can now see your point of view on them. The wording of my second question is especially skeptical. I am not sure how to change it, however, I will try to be more neutral in the future. I am willing to change it, but I don't how to change it and still keep the original question in tact.
I don't think you should delete your replies because I think they are based in healthy skepticism. In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with wanting to protect this DU group from mockery and insults.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)it's usually not overt or so direct. It's subtle, or simply not addressed at all. The few members here that do sometimes question something are reasonable in their approach. It never comes across in the incredulous tone I mentioned above. Read more of GG's method of being critical without being disrespectful. I think he's got the knack for the most part
Now, your post-title deserves to be addressed:
Okay, I understand that's how you think. However, before posting here, you must understand that we truly do believe in "other ways of knowing", that idea that is so resoundingly rejected by the rest of the sceptics elsewhere on DU. This topic on someone talking to the spirits of the bees is a perfect example of another way of knowing information that will likely never be acceptable to your average sceptic. Okay, fine. Just don't bring that attitude here. It's really not welcome.
And if you're fine with my original reply, then I'll leave it alone, unless Bonnie objects. Then it may be edited with a note of explanation.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)I hope that I never tell anyone else how they should approach discovery and truth within this protected group.
Additionally, I will not mock anything I read here, or bring it elsewhere for mockery.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)Is that you get to decide for yourself what is real and what is metaphor.
The other nice thing is you don't get to decide that for anyone else...
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)It doesn't surprise me that a few of us twitched at your question, though. Words are touchy things, and DU has a history of being hard on people with non-mainstream beliefs. Which is odd, considering that progressive liberalism itself is a decidedly non-mainstream position in America.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)I am a skeptic. I do use a different belief system than many who post here. Many skeptics do mock the concepts often supported in this group.
The reaction is natural, in my opinion. I completely understand, and I take absolutely no offense from people questioning my posting here.
kimmerspixelated
(8,423 posts)I get such a giggle for your little moving figure thingy.. So, I must ask... Where? How?? I've been looking for a moving character, but I don't know where to look.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)It just made me smile since it is grotesque and cute at the same time.
If you go Google Images, and type "animated gif," you'll get a bunch. However, you have to click on them to see how they move.
http://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&hl=en&source=hp&biw=1217&bih=894&q=animated+gif&gbv=2&oq=animated+gi&aq=0&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_l=img.1.0.0l10.2242.3599.0.5088.11.10.0.1.1.0.210.989.4j5j1.10.0...0.0.G1UON7LmYdA
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)Ricochet21
(3,794 posts)the left brain is the answer for everything. Septics. That was great.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)Some in occult circles believe the body is sacred, and therefore, everything that comes from the body is sacred too. The use of human excrement in ritual practice is rare, but it is not unheard of. For these folks, shit is often associated with the sun and the color gold. Other bodily fluids, such as saliva, blood, and cum are much more common.
Some members of the O.T.O. cook with menstrual blood when making sacred food items. Menstrual blood is associated with the Moon, and is called, "Blood of the Moon, monthly." The leaders of the cult say members can't serve the congregation menstrual blood at official Gnostic Masses, so many members just started calling all of their Gnostic Masses "unofficial."
edit: I hope discussing hard core ritual magick is OK for this group.
icymist
(15,888 posts)You have taken this thread way off topic. If you wish to discuss O.T.O. or G.: D.: you are welcomed to do so at the AWPS group where there will be more that are quite familiar with this topic. Please do not hijack the topic about bees in this way. Thank you for understanding.
ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)My bad.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)Last edited Mon Jun 11, 2012, 05:45 PM - Edit history (1)
Any time I see someone talking about bees in a positive way, I am reminded of the work Layne Redmond has done researching ancient frame-drummers. I can't do much searching here at work (almost every link in DU is partially blocked) so you'll have to look her up yourself. I'll amend this post this evening with proper links.
Suffice it to say, she's discovered that the ancient Greek drummers were no only women, but keepers of bees!
eta - Here's a blog of Layne's about the ancient beekeepers: Sacred Path of the Bee
kimmerspixelated
(8,423 posts)Learning about bees and belief systems!
I like all of what has happened here.
A pause of gratitude.
get the red out
(13,586 posts)And I love this concept of bee communication. I view "spirit" in all things so how can anything NOT have "spirituality" and exist? That's just my opinion, today anyway.
kentauros
(29,414 posts)And what's so odd about that is I remember reading in the old Gnosis Magazine of a belief from Jewish mystics. That is, everything, from the tiniest particle of matter to the largest and most complex, has the "spark" of the Divine in it. It has to, if it was created by Divine energy or process. To me, that means everywhere is a "holy place". It's all been touched by the Divine and equal to all other particles with that spark. Nothing can be more equal than anything else
I seem to recall some of the out of body practitioners I've read speaking of making contact with inanimate matter. Of course, Carlos Castaneda had his "inorganic beings" in "The Art of Dreaming". There's really no reason why this can't be, so long as Spirit is real and does indeed exist in everything
kimmerspixelated
(8,423 posts)Ricochet21
(3,794 posts)I'd like to learn about the birds next!
kimmerspixelated
(8,423 posts)Bird, Bird is the word.
Sorry I couldn't help myself...
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)You already know about "the Moon up above", Ric!
Ricochet21
(3,794 posts)a to z
Let me tell ya....
oh yeh
OMG, I just had to add THIS!!!!
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)Everything shared was valuable to either the one sharing or those who receive the sharing.
I stand with my feet on the ground and my head in the sky. I seek balance. Practice kindness as much as possible. I believe I am fully human and fully Divine. I feel myself called by Source, whatever, wherever that is. I am grateful to be here having this experience. Because of my Divine nature I can forgive myself and love myself, even when I fall short of my own expectations because I am so fully human.
kimmerspixelated
(8,423 posts)I'm sorry, I COULD NOT help myself!!!
But other than that, I must say that no matter what the subject matter is, you invariably always add such amazing and profound insight!
PLEASE come back more often!
TownDrunk2
(63 posts)Thank you BanzaiBonnie for your post - I was starting to think I was going a tad daft I saw Queen of the Sun, and a few other documentaries on our bees.
Mine should be here in a week or so - bought a top bar hive and starter nuc - can't wait. I found Michael Bush and the natural beekeepers and I think there's hope if we do listen to them. I'll try my best.
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)From another TownDrunk! LOL
Please keep us posted on how your beekeeping goes!
TownDrunk2
(63 posts)I have high hopes and will keep you posted
Like your nym *lmao*
Fire Walk With Me
(38,893 posts)Thanks for this topic. Please ask your friend to tell them that we love them dearly and to please forgive those who do not understand them.
Fire Walk With Me
(38,893 posts)Thanks for this topic. Please ask your friend to tell them that we love them dearly and to please forgive those who do not understand them.
PufPuf23
(9,233 posts)luv_mykatz
(441 posts)I have read some interesting thoughts about bees. One mention was in the book, "Rolling Thunder" by Doug Boyd. Rolling Thunder was a Cherokee shaman who lived with the Western Shoshone Indians, in Nevada. He taught a woman who was an herbalist but was deathly allergic to bee stings, to communicate with the bees. I found the description of the encounter very moving.
The other spiritual mention of bees, is in a book by Starhawk, called "The Fifth Sacred Thing". Very powerful stuff, IMOP.
Bonnie, what you've shared with us is very beautiful. Please, please, continue to share when you can.
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)My maiden name means "beekeeper", but I am quite allergic to them.....always thought that was ironic. Please let us know when the book comes out.
Where would one see, or find, "Queen of the Sun"?
BanzaiBonnie
(3,621 posts)but I did find one site that said you could view it free online. Rotten Tomatoes gave it a 97% good rating.
It is lightyears ahead of most documentaries, as far as being entertaining. The old European beekeepers are a hoot. One in particular. I won't add any spoilers.
You will learn about many of the factors of CCD and what we can do about it. My brother keeps bees even though he's deadly allergic to them. He says they make him feel calm. He does keep an EPI pen handy.
southerncrone
(5,510 posts)If you find another outlet, please post. I'll look, too.
snot
(10,702 posts)I did not read Zombie Horde's initial question as hostile the wording seemed to me neutral and just seeking clarification.