30 years of U.S. gun deaths vs. 30 years of "The Troubles" in Ireland

[GenXer47]

https://www.statista.com/statistics/258913/number-of-firearm-deaths-in-the-united-states/

Add up those #'s and it's around 1 million in a 30-year period, 1990 - 2021.

Now check out "The Troubles" in Ireland

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Troubles

For the entire 30-year period, the # killed was around 3500. Now, you say, Ireland is a very small country. Adjusting per-capita, under "Casualties" on the Wiki page:

If the equivalent ratio of victims to population had been produced in Great Britain in the same period some 100,000 people would have died, and if a similar level of political violence had taken place, the number of fatalities in the USA would have been over 500,000".[290] Using this relative comparison to the US, analyst John M. Gates suggests that whatever one calls the conflict, it was "certainly not" a "low intensity conflict".[291]

So: even adjusting to a per-capita basis, which I hate, because lives are lives (!), we still have DOUBLE the problem. Double the Troubles, as it were.

Think about that! We accept, per-capita, double the murders, during "peacetime", as a country which considered itself very much in a civil war.
Is this what our lives are worth? Is America just that much of a shithole country?

[AndyS]

1. We are at war, with the gun culture.

A culture totally created by the gun industry.

[LastDemocratInSC]

3. Correct.

[TexasDem69]

2. Agree that there are too many people in the US

Who have no regard for others.

[jimmy the one]

4. The 2 decade old, Red State Murder Problem

GunXer: We accept, per-capita, double the murders, during "peacetime", as a country which considered itself very much in a civil war. Is this what our lives are worth? Is America just that much of a shithole country?

Some of us are doing better at handling murder & violent crime than others.

The Two-Decade Red State Murder Problem

1 The murder rate in the 25 states that voted for Donald Trump has exceeded the murder rate in the 25 states that voted for Joe Biden in every year from 2000 to 2020
2 If Blue State murder rates were as high as Red State murder rates, Biden-voting states would have suffered over 45,000 more murders between 2000 and 2020.
3 If Blue State murder rates were as high as Red State murder rates, Biden-voting states would have suffered over 45,000 more murders between 2000 and 2020.

As we noted in our last report, Republicans do a much better job blaming others for crime than actually stopping it.

Republicans have made crime a major selling point over the past several elections. In 2020 and 2022, they ran ads accusing Democratic candidates of wanting to “defund the police”.. In Oct 2022, one-quarter of ads from Republican candidates and PACs focused on crime.

In March of 2022, we released a report that found murder rates in 2020 were 40% higher in Trump-voting states than Biden-voting states... [then] we studied homicide data going back to 2000 to see if this one-year Red State murder epidemic was an anomaly. It was not. Despite a media narrative to the contrary, a wide and widening Red State murder gap has spanned the past two decades.

And while media reports give the impression that murder rates are skyrocketing in blue areas, murder rates have actually increased at far higher rates in Trump-voting states over the past two decades, widening the Red State murder gap from a low of 9% in 2003 and 2004 to a high of 44% in 2019, before falling to 43% in 2020. Since 2000, murder rates have increased 39.4% in red states and just 13.4% in blue states.

Some on the right argue that murder rates in red states are higher because of the blue cities in those red states [with dem mayors, or vote dem - Hous & Dallas both voted Hillary ~55% - 45% - jimmy]
Of course, blue states have more blue urban areas than red states. That is what makes most states blue. The fact is that murder rates have increased in urban, suburban, and rural areas... [Note that red state big cities tend to still adopt their red state's position on guns, within reason for rural or urban - jimmy]
... to answer these critics, we performed an exercise to give red states a special boost. .. we removed all of the murders in the county with the largest city for 19 of 25 red states. In six rural red states home to no cities with large numbers of murders, this calculation was not possible
Over the course of the full 21 years between 2000 and 2020, the Red State murder rate was still 12% higher than the Blue State murder rate, even when murders in the largest cities in those red states were removed. And the murder rate was still higher in 18 of 21 years. https://www.thirdway.org/report/the-two-decade-red-state-murder-problem

Why are Murder Rates Persistently Higher in Red States?
1 Guns: Gun ownership rates are far higher in red states than blue states.
2 Poverty: Studies have found a correlation between poverty and violent crime
3 Educational Attainment:
4 Social Service and Police Resources: Despite accusations that Democrats “defund the police,” we found that cities with Democratic mayors fund police at far higher levels on a per capita basis than cities run by Republican mayors. In 2020, the 25 largest Democrat-run cities spent 38% more on policing per capita than the 25 largest Republican-run cities.

[jimmy the one]

5. Violent Crime Index State Comparision

Some parts of our country USA are doing better than others.
Violent crime index (includes violent crime + property crime)

Safest States, 6 of safer top 10 are blue states, albeit with varying gun control; the 4 safer red states have a combined population of ~4.3millions, less than half the population of new jersey (~9m). These 4 red states have low population densities, more rural, not urbanized like NJ, CN, VA.

~2022 stats: 1. 950 Vermont / 626,358 ..... 2. 956 New Hampshire / 1,321,069
3. 985 North Dakota / 704,925 ...... 4. 1,017 Maine / 1,328,535
5. 1,042 South Dakota / 834,708 .....6. 1,068 Idaho / 1,599,464
7. 1,125 Virginia / 8,185,131 ....8. 1,136 Wyoming / 575,251
9. 1,171 Connecticut / 3,592,053 ......10. 1,180 New Jersey / 8,874,374

States with the 15 highest 'most dangerous' violent crime index. The 4 'unsafer' blue states Md, Del, Nev, NM have a combined population of ~13 millions, less than half of Texas alone (30 millions).
The District of Columbia should not be included in a states list since it is a city not a state. It is included in crime reports since omitting DC would not give a complete picture of entire US crime stats.

36. 1,884 Maryland / 5,887,776 ... 37. 1,911 Georgia / 9,907,756
38. 1,938 Oklahoma / 3,818,851 .... 39. 1,941 Alabama / 4,817,678
40. 1,962 Texas / 26,092,033 .... 41. 1,974 Delaware / 917,060
42. 1,986 Alaska / 728,300 .... 43. 2,025 Arizona / 6,561,516
44. 2,065 Arkansas / 2,947,036 .... 45. 2,095 Florida / 19,361,792
46. 2,167 Louisiana / 4,601,049 .... 47. 2,180 Nevada / 2,761,584
48. 2,194 Tennessee / 6,451,365 .... 49. 2,241 New Mexico / 2,080,085
50. 2,253 South Carolina / 4,727,273 ...... 51. 3,747 District of Columbia / 633,736
---------------------------------
The states with the highest murder rates in the United States are Louisiana, Missouri, South Carolina, Arkansas, Tennessee, Alaska, Maryland, Oklahoma, Mississippi and North Carolina, but it is the District of Columbia that has the highest murder rate in the US, with a rate of 49.2 murder per 100,000 people.

Only Maryland (read Baltimore) is a blue state ranking 7th highest murder rate.
The District of Columbia is not a state, disregard the last sentence above it is misleading. DC has a population density of ~5,000 people per square mile. States pop densities range from ~30 to 200 (Alaska 01 tho also misleading since concentrated population).
DC only included in figures since to omit DC would not render a complete report of total US violent crime.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

6. As Andy says below, "We are at war, with the gun culture."

If we are to learn anything from The Troubles, it should be that renewed regulations on guns and weapons was not the solution. The politically negotiate resolution wasn't based on the "five techniques" nor the events of Bloody Sunday.

There are those in a certain party here who advocate for more guns and few limitations. That's a war with a wedge issue.

I like the idea of limiting concealed carry to those with a state issued permit or license. I'm not a fan of open carry within city limits. I'd also like to see the broken parts of the NICS fixed.

I've heard that the UK has much better gun laws than the US. I guess that explains the civilians resorting to explosives. Keep in mind that the basis for many IEDs is the chemical known as TATP which is derived acetone which is the main component in nail polish remover.

IMO, all of the measures which work to keep weapons out of the wrong hands are still incomplete if the underlying problems are not addressed.