Soujourner Truth was the original Third Waver

[Catherina]

(cross-posted from Meta

I posted this as part of a Meta discussion about the 2nd and 3rd wave because I don't see the waves as chronological phases. I see them as having always overlapped and that even at the beginning of the Suffragette movement, there were plenty of 3rd Wavers and Lipstick Feminists.)

I see her that way because in gender and race issues throughout the history of Feminism the relationship between feminists and civil rights activists, progressive movements was very uneasy and non-Whites felt that the main Feminist groups tolerated the most insidious kinds of chauvinism, patriarchy and bigotry.

"So, too, our histories with feminism. It is because white women inherently kept gatekeeping the right to determine the forms and agenda of feminist movement building that Alice Walker felt so compelled to create womanism, that Barbara Smith and the members of Combahee had to articulate what Black feminism looked like, that Fran Beale and the members of the TWWA had to articulate what a third world feminism looked like, that Gloria Anzaldua had to articulate what a Chicana feminism looked like."

http://crunkfeministcollective.wordpress.com/2011/10/06/i-saw-the-sign-but-did-we-really-need-a-sign-slutwalk-and-racism/


Suggested reading for anyone interested in this

1. Michelle Wallace: "Anger in Isolation: A Black Feminist's Search for Sisterhood,"
2. Margaret Simons: "Racism and Feminism: A Schism in the Sisterhood"
3. "Vol. 9.1 - A History of Black Feminism in the U.S." http://www.mit.edu/~thistle/v9/9.01/6blackf.html
4. Audre Lorde: "I am your sister"
5. Audre Lorde, Cheryl Clarke: "Sister Outsider: Essays and Speeches"
6. Anything by Dorothy Sue Cobble, Silke Roth, Bell Hooks and Kimberly Springer who wrote about the racism within the predominately White Feminist movement

and it's still going on, to this day. The transphobia, so viciously expressed by some Feminists, stems from the same roots. So does the demand that you only have allegiance to Feminism and no other -isms.

This is just one current example and write up about the racism still prevalent: "White Privilege Diary Series #1 - White Feminist Privilege in Organizations"

Back to Soujourner. I read her short speech "Ain't I A Woman" as a slap in the face to the racists, especially the racist male and female supporters of Feminism who didn't want her to speak, even to the more kind-hearted but privileged ones who wanted to keep race issues out of the picture.

She was accused of being a man and bared her breasts to prove she wasn't, saying "Ain't I A Woman". Shortly afterwards she gave her famous speech off the top of her head.

The incident at Inez Milholland's grave was another ugly show, among many. It looks to me like the third wave was there from the beginning and gained strength as people's attitudes evolved.


Here's an amazing book on the subject



http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/250792.Ain_t_I_a_Woman

[JustAnotherGen]

1. Another good read

http://www.amazon.com/Sister-Citizen-Shame-Stereotypes-America/dp/0300165412
Sister Citizen: Shame, Stereotypes, and Black Women in America - Melissa Harris-Perry

My 12 and 19 year old nieces have even picked up and read cover to cover. Is the racism of yester year prevalent today? I would like to think not. But it does show the day to day ADDITION of racial stereotypes on top of gender that Black American women experience today.

[Catherina]

3. I would like to think not too

and my first reaction is to say no it isn't but in my heart, I believe it is with structural racism inserted in the most insidious way. This is why I like the Third Wave so much, because they're asking hard questions and trying to deal with the answers.

What do you think after listening to this? This woman always give me so much to think about.

I wish I knew where to find the rest of her lecture.

[1StrongBlackMan]

2. Thank you ...

for posting this.

I think I have found another place (the Feminist Group) to visit on this site, and another poster that I will seek out!

Though I suspect that I will not be posting to the thread, other than to ask questions; as I am a firm believer that as a male, even an interested male supporter of women's equality, my job is to LISTEN, and ACCEPT what is said in the forum as the truth of your experience. And then it is my job, as an interested male supporter of women's equality, to take what I have heard and communicate, as best I can, your truth to other males.

[Catherina]

4. I can't speak for the forum

but from my understanding, and experience, everyone is welcome here regardless of gender.

I understand why you said that but if we in turn, turn around and tell men to shut up and look pretty, how far have we really come? Other than separatists, 2nd wave feminists have always welcomed the support of men and have worked with men, as did 1st wave feminists, including the suffragettes. There's no question about the 3rd wave.

I hope you participate. We don't bite, I promise.

By the way, the respect is mutual. I've enjoyed your posts in GD, they really stood out.

[1StrongBlackMan]

8. Thank you ...

I appreciate the invitation; but will spare the forum members from having to tell me to STFU.

I have found that, even the well-meaning, committed, dominant group member more often than not brings with them a "Super-Save-A-{insert group} ... I know what's best for you" attitude to their activism.

I will not be that guy!

I, once, after suffering months of a particularly arrogant (white), and wealthy, "civil rights warrior" (his self-descriptor), telling me that his experiences with racism were as, if not more, valid than my experiences with racism.

I was ultimately expelled from the Civil Rights organization that he was involved with (read: funded) because I told him, that while I appreciated his support, in terms of the racial civil rights battle, he could be a "Warrior"; but not the Chief ... he could be a foot soldier, a sargeant, or even a Lt.; but he could not be the General ... he could be the chief strategist; but never the Visionary, because at the end of the day, his understanding of racism and its effects are, at best, anecdotal.

[Catherina]

9. I appreciate your sensitivity about it

and will look forward to your contributions all the more fellow foot soldier.

[kdmorris]

6. Like Catherina, I would welcome your posts

I assume from your postings and your user name that you are black. In society at large, I, as a white woman, have more power than you do. Yes, this is the feminist forum and it's preferable to keep the postings about Feminism and the discussion of what can be done to further that cause.

But I think we can learn from others who have gone before us (such as African Americans) to try to work together so that everyone is equal.

[Neoma]

10. Don't be silly, of course you're welcome.

The whole point is for women and men to try to work together as a team to figure out all of our problems. Feminism addresses female problems more because we have more of an unequal footing. Trying to become equals does not mean shutting men up and pushing them away. It's to look for solutions to every day problems that women and sometimes men, face.

[Metatron]

15. Excellent points, Neoma.

That is exactly how I feel.

[kdmorris]

5. I don't know much about the definitions

of these terms, but I do see them at work a lot. There's almost a hierarchy of oppression in the power structure of the US. (white men have more privilege than white women, white women have more privilege than black men, black men more than black women, etc). When we fight for the end to only one form of oppression IN MY OPINION - we join in the oppression of others. If I only care about the suffering of women but ignore the greater barriers to equality for a black woman... I am, in effect, participating in the subjugation of the black woman.

I'm sure that was kind of weirdly worded, but I'm quite tired today.

[Catherina]

11. That was well worded

I may quote you one day "If I only care about the suffering of women but ignore the greater barriers to equality for a black woman... I am, in effect, participating in the subjugation of the black woman."

I tried to touch on that the other day when I went on a rant in Meta. I admit I was angry, even more so because I live somewhere where the women don't have much privilege and it infuriates me to come to DU and see how so much energy is sucked into rigid, shallow and intolerant drama.

The activist world has moved past

words like *b* and *c* recognizing that the casual use of those words by a few brain-dead people is NOTHING next to the economic exploitation of the current *b* and *c*'s of this world who are expected to subsidize the great American fantasy that you can polish your nails all day sipping coffee sweetened with the tears of some Central American woman whose land was stolen, husband massacred and kids raped so your sugar companies can sell you cheap sugar to sweeten your bitter coffee (from beans from another woman's tears) as you sit there complaining that some disembodied ass on the internet used the word *b*.

OMG. Get me my smelling salts! Vapors. Pearls! Clutch my chest! Ponies! Ponies! Alert!

Here's my take, the word police only works to divide. As long as they can keep people focused, better yet divided, on stupid words, the longer the exploiters can continue the international, economic and really debilitating rape of our *sisters* around the world.

"Beulah hand me a grape".

http://www.democraticunderground.com/124096792#post58

Gormy Cuss explained the wave terminology this way "The wave terminology is shorthand for different eras with different focuses" and RainDog wrote a brilliant post about the details in the same thread.

Here's an excerpt of what Raindog wrote but I encourage everyone to read it.

1st wave feminism: voting rights, property rights, birth control (that existed at the time - condoms or sponges and, just as important, education about sexuality and how to prevent conception.)
2nd wave feminism: sexual freedom, legislative work to change sexist law, integration into the workplace, equal funding, integration into the political arena
3rd wave feminism: sexual freedom, inclusion of gendered females, diversity, inclusion of women of color and women from other cultures - plus the issues surrounding both 1st and 2nd wave feminism.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/124096792#post231

I love what you wrote. No woman is free until all women are free.

[kdmorris]

18. I just got a chance to read this

THANK YOU!! (and Gormy Cuss) for the education

I guess I'm a Third Wave Feminist.

[Metatron]

7. I'm really glad you posted this here, Catherina

I really appreciated your other posts in the H&M threads, too. And, that bell hooks book is great.

[Catherina]

12. Thanks Metatron

I've fallen in intellectual love with several posters in Meta this week and your appreciation is flattering.

Did you read this gem by Obamanaut? I just saw it and it left me speechless.

"Redneck" women,TG women etc., were very much not wanted, and were often actively denied participation. They were considered an embarrassment, even by people we often lionized as leaders and pioneers of feminism (ie Gloria Steinem). Steinem has since walked back most of her views on these marginalized groups of women, but she wrote and spoke some pretty hurtful stuff. I don't mean to pick on Gloria, she's just the most well-known.

Also, remember that the above groups of women were often more than one of these categories: a redneck lesbian working in a textile mill for low wages, a black blue collar women working as a maid, etal. Many didn't have the luxury to discuss feminist political theory: they were trying to put food on the table and not get fired for trying to unionize while they worked full time and took GED classes at night.

There IS a privilege for white, straight women with a decent amount of money that many other women don't have. That doesn't mean there is an "Oppression Olympics," but rather that they have less factors that cause their oppression (unless one is disabled). Their main oppression is gender. Not race or class or sexual orientation or education. I can't remember which DU poster said this once, maybe Lioness Priyanka? But it's stayed with me. I'm paraphrasing, but they said you fight about power struggles within your marriage, while we fight for the right to marry. That is very illustrative, I think.

This is why intersectionality also comes into play so much today in modern American society and feminism.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1240&pid=97490

[Metatron]

14. Thanks for reposting that insightful comment - I had missed it.

It's funny that you mention falling "in intellectual love" with several posters this week, because you, lilypaddle, and many others made such an impression on me in H&M that I feel more comfortable de-lurking.

[Catherina]

16. I knew there was a silver lining to all that Meta drama

The wheels of justice grind in a mysterious way.

I made some real friendships there this week.

Jump in, dive in my friend! I'm glad you delurked

[Whisp]

13. bookmarking. ty Cath.

[Catherina]

17. Anytime Whisp

I wish it were more thought out but it's the carbon copy of a Meta post so I wasn't structuring anything.

I'm off to crosspost it in the AA forum now.

And Whisp, thanks for hanging in there all these months and being such a solid ally of truth.

I love you sister.