Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Israeli

(4,249 posts)
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 04:49 AM Sep 6

Biden, if You Really Want to Understand Netanyahu, Listen to What He Says in Hebrew

For Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, the Philadelphi route in Gaza is now the fastest way out of any possible cease-fire and hostage deal. The U.S. administration would know that if it paid more attention to his Hebrew speeches over the past months

Haaretz | Israel News
by Alon Pinkas
Sep 5, 2024

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu speaks Hebrew and English fluently – yet things get lost in translation when he deliberately says different things to different audiences.
One of his most prominent political-rhetorical characteristics is that on the same topic and issue, the Hebrew and the English texts are not compatible. What is truly odd is that the only ones who do not seem aware or alert to his linguistic discrepancies are the Americans.

They should know by now that going back to a used car dealership and buying a car without an engine from the same salesman who sold you a car without the wheels is not savvy policy. But this week, even the inconsistencies in his Hebrew and English speeches proved the same thing: he has no intention whatsoever of reaching any kind of hostage-release deal.

Any agreement – assuming Hamas even accepts one, which Netanyahu is counting on them not to – that would mean the de facto end of the war is unacceptable to him. He needs the war to go on, motivated by his political survival and callosity toward the hostages and their families. Still, it is worthwhile looking at the gaps between his two lectures.

Take for example the Philadelphi route, that 14-kilometer (8-mile) stretch at the southern tip of Gaza that separates the Strip from Egypt. As his most novel excuse and pretext to evade a hostage deal and cease-fire, Netanyahu – who spent his childhood in Philadelphia – had a eureka moment: Turn it into a strategic, existential issue.

Continued @ : https://archive.md/KFWgB#selection-1175.0-1283.298
No paywall .
11 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies

moniss

(5,036 posts)
1. This touches on an excellent point
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 05:58 AM
Sep 6

and it has happened before in the region. Even back during the period of the Mandate and it's end there were examples of things said in Arabic that didn't really accurately convey what was said in English etc. and vice-versa. Some of the old local leaders would get a wrong translation or only a partial one. Sometimes in diplomatic relations/negotiations between countries around the world this can be a gamesmanship sort of thing.

So you could get "negotiators" going to a meeting and saying that someone they represent had agreed to this or that when in fact they didn't really because the "deal" was misinterpreted. Then later on people are running on 2 different tracks. In the case of Netanyahu he is doing this purposely since he knows he can largely get away with saying it one way in Hebrew and then give it a different "twist" in English.

Aussie105

(5,995 posts)
2. Not unusual for a leader to vary his sales pitch depending on the audience.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 07:02 AM
Sep 6

But yes, his Hebrew speeches as translations into English may be interesting to read, if done accurately.

Mosby

(17,022 posts)
3. So you don't think Israel should control it's southern border?
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 07:08 PM
Sep 6

My question is how this even become a negotiating point? Since when can't a country control its borders?

Is it because it's Israel?

Hmmm.

TomSlick

(11,591 posts)
4. The "Philadelphia Corridor" that Netanyahu insists on controlling is not on the Israeli border.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 07:49 PM
Sep 6

He is talking about controlling the Gaza border with the Egyptian Sinai peninsula.

Mosby

(17,022 posts)
5. Thats not true
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 07:56 PM
Sep 6

The Israelis aready put down asphalt on their side.




So again, why should Israel rely on Egypt of all people to secure the border? The Egyptians take bribes, including from Trump. The military government can't be trusted.

TomSlick

(11,591 posts)
6. Netanyahu disagrees with you.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 08:20 PM
Sep 6

I watched his lecture on the history of the Philadelphi Corridor. He was clear that he was talking about the Gaza / Sinai border. Israel would not need to occupy Gaza to control its own border.

?im=FitAndFill=(1200,675)

Mosby

(17,022 posts)
7. Yeah, so what? The Gaza border is part of Israel's southern border.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 08:30 PM
Sep 6

Gaza has no independent status, in fact they are illegally being controlled by Hamas. Israel has every right to secure all of the southern border, including though Gaza.

TomSlick

(11,591 posts)
8. If you take the position that Gaza belongs to Israel, then you are correct.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:04 PM
Sep 6

Gaza is a humanitarian disaster. Israel does not want to control, or be responsible for, Gaza - just its borders. Gaza's, living in the rubble, are on their own.

AloeVera

(1,588 posts)
10. Gaza does not belong to Israel.
Wed Sep 11, 2024, 11:47 AM
Sep 11

Israel has no border with Egypt through Gaza.

But thanks for clarifying for us that you stand on the side of denying statehood and self-determination to Palestinians and taking their land for Israel.




Beastly Boy

(10,636 posts)
11. Gaza doesn't belong to Hamas either.
Wed Sep 11, 2024, 12:34 PM
Sep 11

It belongs to the Palestinian Authority, which represents Palestinian territories.

The negotiations are between two belligerent combatants, not two sovereign states, so the border in question is not an international border. In this case, it is the border that separates the sovereign state of Egypt and a war zone. Hamas has no legal claim to it, and neither does Israel. The entirety of the border between Egypt and the war zone is currently being controlled by IDF, a belligerent party in the conflict between Israel and Hamas. That certainly makes it a border between Israel's armed forces and Egypt, for as long as IDF controls it.

Gaza does not belong to Hamas, yet it is Hamas that makes demands on IDF presence in the Philadelphi corridor. If Bibi's demands are objectionable, so are Hamas'.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Israel/Palestine»Biden, if You Really Want...