Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

no more banksters

(395 posts)
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 11:15 AM Oct 2015

Three basic factors which the Marxist theory is not taking account

There are at least three basic factors today which Karl Marx wouldn't be possible to predict, to be included in the Marxist theory.

1st: The rapid transfer of huge amounts of capital across the world.

2nd: The explosive increase of human population which leads to oversupply of human labor and consumers.

3rd: The hyper-automation of production.


http://failedevolution.blogspot.gr/2015/10/three-basic-factors-which-marxist.html
7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Three basic factors which the Marxist theory is not taking account (Original Post) no more banksters Oct 2015 OP
And, I may be off-base with this; but ... 1StrongBlackMan Oct 2015 #1
Well, one hundred fifty years is a cloudy lens to look through, rogerashton Oct 2015 #3
I think you need to re-read Marx fasttense Oct 2015 #2
As fasttense says, it would help rogerashton Oct 2015 #4
Thank you for your answers no more banksters Oct 2015 #5
Mmm. Starry Messenger Oct 2015 #6
Theories on overproduction, monopolies, crisis - TBF Oct 2015 #7
 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
1. And, I may be off-base with this; but ...
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 11:38 AM
Oct 2015

Having developed his theory in a virtual racial vacuum ... I don't think he could have anticipated the depth of racism.

rogerashton

(3,943 posts)
3. Well, one hundred fifty years is a cloudy lens to look through,
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 12:32 PM
Oct 2015

so it is hard to be absolutely sure. After all, the first use of the term "racism" seems to have been in the twentieth century. However, Marx as a journalist covered the civil war, and his comments on it may say something about his attitude toward what we now call "racism."

https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/newspape/internationalist/pamphlets/MARX-on-Slavery-OptV5.pdf

Anyway, no party has more consistently stood for black people's rights than the Communist Party. And no, I am not a Communist myself -- but this is just a matter of historic fact.

 

fasttense

(17,301 posts)
2. I think you need to re-read Marx
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 11:47 AM
Oct 2015

He addresses the transfer of wealth throughout the globe. True it didn't travel as quickly back then but it did move around a lot.

This supposed over supply of labor is part of the built in antagonism between workers and employees. To say Marx doesn't address it clearly indicates you do not understand how Marx defines labor.

So many capitalist think automation is just so over powering today. But the truth is there is plenty of manual labor being done in factories and fields. It just not being seen by people in the middle class and rich in the US and other rich nations. It's being done by millions of Chinese, Indians, and other underpaid labor. The capitalists have moved most of the heavy labor jobs out of sight.

Marx has put togeather a well developed analysis of capatalism that is still relevant today.

rogerashton

(3,943 posts)
4. As fasttense says, it would help
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 12:45 PM
Oct 2015

if you knew something about Marx' ideas. It is impossible to competently criticize ideas you have not understood.

1. So what is the significance of this

rapid transfer of huge amounts of capital across the world
? It is the internationalization of what Marx called "the socialization of production." And Marx did anticipate that the socialization of production would continue without limits.

2. Marx wrote extensively about "relative surplus-population," and rejected Malthus' theory on this, which was already 60 years old when he wrote. Marx' theory held that capitalism, not population growth, was the cause of relative surplus-population. Perhaps Malthus was right and Marx was wrong. If that is your opinion, show us your evidence.

3. The replacement of workers by technologically advanced machines, technological unemployment, is an idea that was present in David Ricardo's 1821 revision of his Principles of Political Economy and Taxation, which probably influenced Marx more than any other economic writing.

Now, it is true that Marx did not use 2015 catch-phrases for these very old ideas -- and the better for it.

no more banksters

(395 posts)
5. Thank you for your answers
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 01:45 PM
Oct 2015

It's an interesting discussion so far, indeed.

Please pay attention to the words: rapid, explosive and hyper.

More will follow soon.

Starry Messenger

(32,375 posts)
6. Mmm.
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 04:50 PM
Oct 2015

Lenin covers your 1st. https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/ Paul Sweezy has worked on this issue too: http://monthlyreview.org/1994/06/01/the-triumph-of-financial-capital/ Both built on the work of Marx.

Marx refuted Malthus, point the 2nd. http://www.colorado.edu/Sociology/gimenez/work/popissue.html

The third one I don't have as quick an answer on, but the industrial revolution was a result of the rise of capitalism, so I'm sure Marx was aware of how humans were being replaced by machines. Different theorists have tackled this issue.

That's the thing about theoretical work, people can build on it.

I see in the comments there, that you wanted to draw attention to the aspect of speed. I hope you'll elaborate.

TBF

(34,179 posts)
7. Theories on overproduction, monopolies, crisis -
Mon Oct 5, 2015, 05:03 PM
Oct 2015

what did he miss? Granted Marx spent much more time on critique of capitalism as opposed to theorizing as to what should replace it, but he wasn't off base and his theory is still as relevant today as it was in the 1800s.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»Socialist Progressives»Three basic factors which...