ISIS burns Mosul library

[SoLeftIAmRight]

http://www.csmonitor.com/Books/chapter-and-verse/2015/0225/ISIS-burns-Mosul-library-Why-terrorists-target-books

From the destruction of the Library of Alexandria in 391 AD, to the burning of Kabul libraries in 2002, to the the obliteration of the Library of Baghdad in 2003, oppressive regimes have historically targeted libraries.

According to reports, ISIS militants rigged the entire building with explosives and carried out multiple detonations to raze the historical landmark and its contents. Among its lost collections, according to the Fiscal Times, were manuscripts from the 18th century, Syriac books printed in Iraq's first printing house in the 19th century, books from the Ottoman era, Iraqi newspapers from the early 20th century, and treasured antiques like an astrolabe and sand glass used by ancient Arabs.

[Fred Sanders]

1. All irreplaceable Muslim texts. I have changed my mind - this IS a religious war, and the religion under attack is Islam.

Hope this speeds up the timetable to kick these murderers and criminals out of Mosul, unspeakable evil enemies of Islam and all religions.

If there is a Satan, ISIS is it.

[lovemydog]

5. It's also got me rethinking my views.

I hear you Fred Sanders. ISIS is attacking Islam. It's horrendous. It's got me rethinking my views on military intervention as well. Not in terms of boots on the ground. I agree with Bernie Sanders though, that we can and should step up our military efforts, provided it's strongly supported by other countries in the region. And that those other countries aren't just sitting back and waiting for us to risk all and spend all first.

[DetlefK]

53. What about the Qurans in that library?

Are we to expect that ISIS skimmed every single shelf and every single archive to remove every single Quran from that building?

[Fred Sanders]

64. Well, since they blew up the library with explosives maybe they did not need to..and they can always come back.

What relgion destroys its own Holy Book?

[DetlefK]

65. Exactly my point:

Holy hell gets raised in Saudi-Arabia and India if there is even a shred of a rumor that somebody destroyed a Quran.

But when ISIS does it... crickets.



Where is the muslim outrage?
Where are the muslim scholars condemning ISIS? (Yes, I know, ordinary muslims already condemned them and their militaries take part in the bombing.)
What is the Arabic League doing? (Apart from sitting on their hands and hoping that the US will solve that problem.) Why aren't they trying to rally the Muslims to extinct this stain on Islam?

[Fred Sanders]

66. I am sorry, sir, I truly can not follow your thought train even out of the station.

[DetlefK]

67. Hmm. Okay, it was a bit farfetched.

Muslim extremists get pissed when it comes to destroying Qurans.
ISIS blows up a library and it is reasonable to assume that Qurans were in there.
Accordingly there should be some kind of outcry, some kind of disgust, some kind of protest in the highest echelons of Islam, denouncing ISIS as enemies of Islam.

If I had thought this through before posting, I would have realized that this will never happen: ISIS simply practices a 7th-century version of Islam in the 21st century. (The good old times when your life revolved around your religion, your sword, burning villages, taking slaves...)

[Fred Sanders]

68. Sorry, same train, new engine.

[lovemydog]

2. Thousands of years of history

destroyed destroyed at the blink of an eye.

I've read that ISIS is teaching kids (the ones they haven't raped or murdered or imprisoned) to ignore all previous history. Reminds me of the horrors of the Khmer Rouge, who declared a 'year zero' in which 'history' only started the year they took over.

There have been some other threads on it here, SoLeftIAmRight.

I'll kick and recommend this too because it's a major tragedy & imho a major story.

[Fred Sanders]

4. If this does not convince folks ISIS is simply Satan in disguise and an enemy of all religions...

[lovemydog]

6. I'd perhaps say an enemy of human rights.

But it's a good point you make, regarding an enemy of Islam. I'm just not that religious. But it's looking more and more like an apocalyptic cult that is raping people and history, every day. It certainly raises the difficult moral question of how do we stop it without doing more harm than good, especially when it appears that our intervention can help stop it.

I liken it (probably too simplistically) to the rise of the Khmer Rouge after Nixon / Kissinger's illegal bombing of Cambodia. I think Bush / Cheney's illegal war in Iraq exacerbated the rise of ISIS. I also wonder how it will be stopped, because it must be stopped to save a lot of innocent people from being wholesale slaughtered.

[Dorian Gray]

54. They're nihilists....

fighting for destruction. No hope. Nothing.

[AngryAmish]

58. I don't have any magical powers.

For example I cannot detect fictional spirits.

You know that Satan does not exist, right?


Cue, Verbal on The Usual Suspects...

[Fred Sanders]

62. Can you detect allegory?

"As a literary device, an allegory in its most general sense is an extended metaphor. Allegory has been used widely throughout the histories of all forms of art, largely because it readily illustrates complex ideas and concepts in ways that are comprehensible to its viewers, readers, or listeners."

[Liberal_in_LA]

29. tragic

[Fred Sanders]

63. Evil. Universal hate and evil. No religion I know of.

[hifiguy]

3. And it is ALWAYS done in the name

of some nonexistent skydaddy. "History does not repeat, but it rhymes." - Mark Twain

[lovemydog]

8. Almost all the time. I love that Mark Twain quote.

I'm not religious either hifiguy. But I think there are some other examples in history where horrific crimes are committed not in the name of some nonexistant sky daddy. Khmer Rouge, Nazi Germany, Stalin, Mao come to mind. I'm not trying to put down your point, which is well-taken. In some ways though I'd suggest that what these mofos in ISIS are doing is actually spitting on Islam, spitting on Christianity, spitting on agnostics, spitting on all human rights involving tolerance & freedom. I think maybe their argument about it being in the name of some nonexistent sky daddy is just bullshit on their part. Maybe a way to rabble up the crazies.

[hifiguy]

12. Even the Khmer Rouge, whom IS is now starting to rival

in terms of pure barbarity, didn't dynamite or damage Angkor Wat. Nor did Stalin, probably the single worst person of the 20th Century, destroy St. Basil's or Peter the Great's castle in St. Petersburg, the Peterhof. As for Germany, the Allies did most of the demolition there, from the air and the Austrian Corporal wasn't into destroying cultural landmarks, whatever else he did; he wanted to enshrine his version of German culture.

Between this and the Taliban's destruction of the Buddhas, we are seeing something that hasn't been seen in hundreds of years: weaponized religious insanity on a mass scale.

Humanity must outgrow Iron Age fairy stories or perish.

[lovemydog]

21. That's a great point hifiguy.

Previously it was more looting rather than destroying.

This level of destruction is mind-blowing.

I recently saw a lecture on cultural art & law. Following World War II, UNESCO drafted international laws against wartime destruction of schools, museums, places of worship.

ISIS is off the rails in terms of international laws and traditional notions of valuing art and history.

I'd no more compare them to Islam than I'd compare the Ku Klux Klan with Christianity. You are right they say they do it 'in the name of'.

I'm not sure why these Iron Age fairy tales persist. I don't mind the ones that don't involve slaughtering others who have different beliefs. I've read that they are demanding of everyone 'give us all your money and convert or we'll kill you.' How can you 'convert' if you don't believe it? Come to think of it, that's the Inquisition demanded as well.

[alarimer]

69. Even the Nazis only stole art; they didn't destroy it.

This seems particularly barbaric.

[hifiguy]

70. When you can truthfully say "Not even the Nazis, Stalin

or the Khmer Rouge" committed a particular atrocity, you have hit the equivalent of zero degrees Kelvin for human behavior.

[Fred Sanders]

22. Muslims, Christians, Yezedis, Buddhists if there were any. ISIS is a common enemy of mankind.

[AtomicKitten]

7. That's a damn shame.

[KamaAina]

9. Just like the Taliban did with the sandstone Buddhas

in Afghanistan.

[lovemydog]

10. I saw a photo of that again yesterday.

It brought tears to my eyes, KamaAina. So much beauty & tradition just blown up.

I'd like to see a documentary about or read more about it. If you or anyone reading can share, it would be appreciated.

[annabanana]

11. This breaks my heart.

Only digitalization can make sure records are un-obliteratable now. I hope many many texts were "backed up".

[lovemydog]

14. I don't know if they were backed up digitally.

That's a really interesting question annabanana.

I'm going to ask an art historian who works in this field next time I see her. I would guess that some of the actual physical copies of texts may in themselves be considered 'sacred.'

Not sure how this might affect whether or not they were digitally saved.

[annabanana]

19. Well if some of the physical texts themselves were considered sacred (like a Torah) then

the loss is complete. And the artistry involved in many such texts is a huge, irrreplaceable loss, however you feel about the content.

[Fred Sanders]

23. The artistry is astonishing:

[Brigid]

43. Yes, it is.

[tridim]

13. Republicans just defund libraries to destroy them.

And we all know how fond they are of rewriting history and altering facts.

Peas in a pod.

[hifiguy]

15. Yep. Even Stalin and Hitler left the libraries open.

Filled with revisionist bullshit, but the buildings were still there to be put to use.

I am convinced that the Pukes would shutter most of the libraries in the US if they could get away with it.

[Glassunion]

17. True. However, the slim pickings meant Dewey had no use for decimals.

[lovemydog]

16. True.

They're not rounding up people into camps, raping and killing them, beheading journalists & blowing up libraries though.

[Marrah_G]

18. They are cowards

They live in fear of knowledge.

[annabanana]

20. And THAT is at the base of it all. . . .n/t

[Fred Sanders]

27. Here is a more complete report:

http://www.bustle.com/articles/66261-isis-burns-8000-books-after-destroying-the-mosul-public-library-in-its-ongoing-cultural-cleansing-of

"Seizing land was just the first step. In its effort to establish a so-called true caliphate, ISIS is now seizing culture as well. Over the weekend, ISIS bombed the Mosul Public Library and burned 8,000 books, many of which were rare titles and manuscripts. The Public Library is the latest target in a series of raids that have demolished libraries in Mosul and elsewhere in Iraq over the past few months. In addition to destroying literature or materials that don’t comply with the group’s interpretation of Islamic Sharia law, ISIS has also been burning religious and cultural institutions, not to mention brutally killing religious and ethnic minorities, systematic attacks that the U.N. has called “cultural cleansing.”

[Fred Sanders]

24. UNESCO statement:

UNESCO has called the destruction of libraries and books in Mosul 'one of the most devastating acts of destruction of library collections in human history.'

[awoke_in_2003]

25. knowledge is the enemy of all religions. nt

[hifiguy]

26. This is one of the few absolute truths I know. Nt

[Fred Sanders]

28. If ISIS were really Muslims, why would they burn their own sacred and priceless books and texts?

It is like the KKK burning down the Vatican and still calling themselves Christians. Would they be if they just say so? Who would believe that?

[ND-Dem]

31. makes you wonder.

[blkmusclmachine]

41. ISIS = Blackwater/Xe or another type of American mercenary outfit???

[Hekate]

48. There's a certain breed of religious fanatic that fears and despises all knowledg but their own...

...most especially religious knowledge. This is nothing new in the history of mankind, nothing new at all.

[melman]

52. Uh

The KKK would love to burn down the Vatican. They hate Catholics.

[Fred Sanders]

59. Uh...

Sure they would. Look how many churches they have burned in America....oh, wait...

[hifiguy]

71. The Klan burned and bombed

Plenty of black churches.

[kelliekat44]

30. I cried when US troops ravished Iraq...this makes me sad. nt

[They_Live]

32. a**h0le5

[Jack Rabbit]

33. Do these morons even know what they're destroying?

There are no words . . .

[Fred Sanders]

34. How could they not? They have been in control of Mosul for a year. Not much longer I think.

[whatchamacallit]

35. More like something Rumsfeld would do

Who is ISIS really?

[blkmusclmachine]

40. "What's the definition of is?"

[Depaysement]

36. Cui Bono?

I wonder.

[Brigid]

37. At one time . . .

Islamic culture far outstripped Christian culture. Muslims even preserved much of ancient culture, such as Greek philosophy, which had disappeared from its original home in Europe during the Dark Ages. Now they're destroying their own treasures. Allah weeps.

[MisterP]

39. a lot of it was right from the Greek horse's mouth, and they vastly built upon it

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Wisdom

whatever Alexandria had, so did Constantiople! even remote Ireland and north Germany were crawling with the subtlest Platonists for centuries

[Fred Sanders]

47. It is not Muslims "destroying their own treasures", it is criminals and murderers who would destroy

the treasures of any religion.....they are enemies of all mankind.

[blkmusclmachine]

38. ISIS may be GOP operatives.

[Brigid]

42. Or maybe, like the Joker in "The Dark Knight" . . .

They just like to destroy stuff and kill people.

[leftynyc]

50. Or maybe they're exactly

what they look like. Religious fanatics that have perverted Islam for their own reasons.

[lastlib]

44. FUCKERS!!

There's a special place in HELL with a nice white-hot fire for these FUCKERS!! Right NEXT to Dick CHENEY and George W. BUSH!!

Dirty FUCKERS!! .

[JDPriestly]

45. K&R.

[PumpkinAle]

46. Afraid of knowledge, afraid of education

and what it will do to their cause..................... very similar to what some want here.

Control knowledge, control the future, control education control power.

[DFW]

49. Cheny, Wolfowitz and Rumsfeld are ultimately to blame for this

Without the insane, useless invasion of Iraq 12 years ago, none of this would have happened.

I'd add W to the list, but he couldn't even tell you what continent Iraq was located in on his own, so I didn't.

[Bosonic]

55. And today wrecking the Nineveh museum, Iraq

[romanic]

56. Something needs to be done about these bastards.

I can't fathom losing all of that history to such barbarism. :mad

[Fred Sanders]

60. There is not "something" being done?.....Google "5000" Airstrikes and"Mosul surrounded"...sigh.....

[seveneyes]

57. If the ISIS torture, rape and murder of humans didn't move people to action against them

Doubtful their destruction of inanimate materials will either.

[Fred Sanders]

61. Last line....makes about as much sense as folks demanding "something" be done! What year is it again?