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choie

(6,492 posts)
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:53 PM Yesterday

What Trump Is Really Doing With His Boat Strikes

This is an incredibly moving and potent essay.

When Trump administration officials post snuff films of alleged drug boats blowing up, of a weeping migrant handcuffed by immigration officers or of themselves in front of inmates at a brutal El Salvadoran prison, I often think of a story St. Augustine told in his “Confessions.”

In the fourth century A.D., a young man named Alypius arrived in Rome to study law. He was a decent sort. He knew the people at the center of the empire delighted in cruel gladiatorial games, and he promised himself he would not go. Eventually, though, his fellow students dragged him to a match. At first, the crowd appalled Alypius. “The entire place seethed with the most monstrous delight in the cruelty,” Augustine wrote, and Alypius kept his eyes shut, refusing to look at the evil around him.

But then a man fell in combat, a great roar came from the crowd and curiosity forced open Alypius’s eyes. He was “struck in the soul by a wound graver than the gladiator in his body.” He saw the blood, and he drank in savagery. Riveted, “he imbibed madness.” Soon, Augustine said, he became “a fit companion for those who had brought him.”

There are many reasons to object to the policies that the Trump administration’s videos and memes showcase. Yet the images themselves also inflict wounds, of the kind that Alypius suffered when he raised his eyelids. The president inhabits a position of moral leadership. When the president and his officials sell their policies, they’re selling a version of what it means to be an American — what should evoke our love and our hate, our disgust and our delight. If all governments rest on opinion, as James Madison thought, then it is this moral shaping of the electorate that gives the president his freedom of action, and that we will still have to reckon with once he is gone.


https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/05/opinion/trump-boat-strikes.html

22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
What Trump Is Really Doing With His Boat Strikes (Original Post) choie Yesterday OP
so roscoeroscoe Yesterday #1
They're like a pack of wild dogs Bayard Yesterday #2
They lack any of the honorable qualities of dogs Mysterian 2 hrs ago #22
Trump got his view of Americans AnnaLee 23 hrs ago #3
Or Dad's Klan Rally attendance. maxsolomon 22 hrs ago #11
Its not new in America, or anywhere else in the world. Srkdqltr 23 hrs ago #4
Can the full swath of Americans examine their cachukis 23 hrs ago #5
It's not that it needs to be examined... Trueblue Texan 22 hrs ago #10
Thought about how Dostoevsky examined the full cachukis 21 hrs ago #19
When it comes to the Mexican wedding cookies with powdered sugar... Trueblue Texan 18 hrs ago #20
There are accounts of some who attended the games to bear witness. miyazaki 23 hrs ago #6
Also no one is talking about the Epstein files! kimbutgar 22 hrs ago #7
It's not civilized. Linda ladeewolf 22 hrs ago #8
I would say they're worse than animals. slightlv 21 hrs ago #17
I suspect he's trying to goad them (either the government or enraged Venezuelans) to lash out paulrevere2018 22 hrs ago #9
By Phil Klay, maxsolomon 22 hrs ago #12
And once enough 'Muricans are desensitized to the violence not fooled 22 hrs ago #13
As long as those who are being killed are "leftists" Democrats, and "Antifa" slightlv 21 hrs ago #18
That may be part of it. Another part of it is to desensitize and normalize the idea of our government randomly killing Fil1957 22 hrs ago #14
Why the death of JFK still matters. Kid Berwyn 22 hrs ago #15
MAGAt rabies is contagious Wicked Blue 21 hrs ago #16
KNR and bookmarking. niyad 3 hrs ago #21

roscoeroscoe

(1,797 posts)
1. so
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:58 PM
Yesterday

And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

Bayard

(28,144 posts)
2. They're like a pack of wild dogs
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:35 PM
Yesterday

The first one that draws blood on their prey drives the rest into a frenzy to finish the kill.

Mysterian

(6,113 posts)
22. They lack any of the honorable qualities of dogs
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 12:47 PM
2 hrs ago

They are filthy cowardly primates who send others to murder for them.

Srkdqltr

(9,206 posts)
4. Its not new in America, or anywhere else in the world.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 04:21 PM
23 hrs ago

After all, we all come from somewhere else in the world. Well most of us.

cachukis

(3,590 posts)
5. Can the full swath of Americans examine their
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 04:25 PM
23 hrs ago

conscience in these times? Inward reflection takes focus. In this world of fast paced distraction, I wonder.

Trueblue Texan

(4,097 posts)
10. It's not that it needs to be examined...
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:16 PM
22 hrs ago

...It's that we need to be conscious of the potentials within us that are being developed. We can either develop those potentials deliberately or by default. The important thing is to know that we have the potential to be as evil as the darkest villain that ever walked the earth or as kind as any saint. We get to choose. We get to choose what is acceptable and what is not. We can easily see what TSF supporters have chosen.

cachukis

(3,590 posts)
19. Thought about how Dostoevsky examined the full
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:28 PM
21 hrs ago

range of good and evil in mankind as I read the article.
Yet, a good number of physicists studying quantum mechanics say free will is non existent.
They conclude we are drawn to our choices by the mathematics of how particles work.
Not sure how we can use that to escape our mishaps, but we got this far mostly because of what we think of as goodness.
I am on your side, evil is not attractive.

Trueblue Texan

(4,097 posts)
20. When it comes to the Mexican wedding cookies with powdered sugar...
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 08:55 PM
18 hrs ago

...I have to give it to the physicists. Otherwise, I have freewill over most things in my life.

miyazaki

(2,584 posts)
6. There are accounts of some who attended the games to bear witness.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 04:28 PM
23 hrs ago

Not everyone succumbs like Alypius.

Linda ladeewolf

(1,036 posts)
8. It's not civilized.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:03 PM
22 hrs ago

Even if death is necessary for an enemy, there should not really be felt any joy in the death itself. Only relief that the enemy will not cause pain and suffering for future others. These people feel joy in the bloodshed and violence. They are uncivilized, more animal than human themselves. They feel hate for anyone different than them in thought or appearance or status. We have fallen into the depravity that has distroyed past civilizations.

slightlv

(7,187 posts)
17. I would say they're worse than animals.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:15 PM
21 hrs ago

Most animals kill for food, for protection of young ones, and to protect their area of land. I can't really think of any animal... other than Man, who kills just for the sheer joy of it.

It's bred into our genes from time immemorial. It takes a lot of strength and fortitude to stop and reflect deep within ourselves to understand what is going on with us. How we let the dark side of our natures take over. Someone once wrote about the "Examined Life"... that seems to be a lost art these days. People go on reaction and instinct alone. Too often, the instinct is to lash out, rather than lend a hand. There are exceptions, as many of the articles I've read on here today demonstrate. And I had my own experience this week that showed the good that still exists.

But I don't think there is any creature more dark, more evil, than man. The only exception to that I want to remember was about a troop of chimps who would commit murder. But then again, it seems like the higher up the evolutionary chain you go, the more murderous we become.

paulrevere2018

(82 posts)
9. I suspect he's trying to goad them (either the government or enraged Venezuelans) to lash out
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:11 PM
22 hrs ago

At a US based business or government office as an excuse to launch a military operation.

not fooled

(6,555 posts)
13. And once enough 'Muricans are desensitized to the violence
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:37 PM
22 hrs ago

then they won't object when Krasnov begins killing dissenting Americans at home.

slightlv

(7,187 posts)
18. As long as those who are being killed are "leftists" Democrats, and "Antifa"
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:17 PM
21 hrs ago

they'll be jubilating as they did in the days of the gladiators, and begging to be a part of the destruction and death. It's killing them they can't all take out their guns and declare war on us right now. I've never seen such a murderous bunch of people. These are the tribes of people that other people moved far away from... when we still had room left on the earth to move to!

Fil1957

(451 posts)
14. That may be part of it. Another part of it is to desensitize and normalize the idea of our government randomly killing
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:41 PM
22 hrs ago

anyone at any time without judicial review.

Their long range goal is to be able do this to anyone in the United States regardless of citizenship, who protests, disagrees with them, or whom they just don't like.

"First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out..."

Kid Berwyn

(22,502 posts)
15. Why the death of JFK still matters.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:44 PM
22 hrs ago

We had a president who served the nation in war and peace.

JFK was ready to give his life to save the lives of his men on PT-109. As Lt. John F. Kennedy, USN, he lost two who were trapped in the engine room when a Japanese destroyer in the black of a moonless night sliced the boat in two, and he never forgot them as president. Several sailors were critically wounded, some burned in the water when fuel ignited. He helped get those to safety the next day, leading the swim to an enemy occupied tropical island about two miles away, gripping the lead chord from the most seriously injured man's life jacket with his teeth.

As president, JFK kept the peace when the generals and admirals counseled all out war over the Bay of Pigs invasion, the Cuban Missile Crisis and later in Vietnam, a French colony of no military threat to the mainland United States, about 8,000 miles from surfin' Malibu. The Military Industrial Complex said that we can't have a healthy economy and peace -- we need to make the machine hum through war.

Like FDR and the New Deal, JFK thought the economy should be geared to helping all Americans. Instead of colonizing planet earth like the French, etc, Kennedy thought the New Frontier could develop outer space as a way of expanding our horizons to new shores. When he wanted civilian cooperation in space with Russia, as a way of preventing WWIII, he proposed going to the moon, a feat considered impossible for almost all human history. Thanks to PAPERCLIP and harnessing the Peenemunde crowd, we accomplished that. Imagine what we could do if he had lived? Full employment? Fair and affordable housing? Equal rights for all Americans?

Yeah, a man who would be a role model to the nation's youth. Instead, we've had generation after generation raised on the "Money trumps peace" philosophy. Bush begat Nixon begat Bush begat Reagan begat Bush begat Bush begat Trump and look around for proof.

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