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Shipwack

(2,955 posts)
Thu Dec 4, 2025, 10:24 PM Thursday

Gov Newsome triangulating again.

Gov. Gavin Newsom (D-Calif.) thinks Democrats need to rein in some of their cultural politics if they want to win over more voters.

“I think there’s a broader narrative that we ought to address,” Newsom said Wednesday at The New York Times’ DealBook Summit. “We have to be more culturally normal. We have to be a little less judgmental.”

The California governor didn’t spell out what he meant by “culturally normal,” but he has recently been a critic of what he calls “woke culture.”


I guess he feels the need to move toward the “center” again to stay relevant…

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/gavin-newsom-tells-democrats-culturally-normal_n_6931dfa1e4b0824b6df8a368
113 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Gov Newsome triangulating again. (Original Post) Shipwack Thursday OP
WTF is "culturally normal?" leftstreet Thursday #1
I would say this is a great example of what he's talking about. Nixie Yesterday #14
Code for "don't talk about trans or non-binary rights"? LudwigPastorius Yesterday #15
rich White male "christian" LuvLoogie Yesterday #82
I think he's saying we need better messaging to get our values out..more on point Deuxcents Thursday #2
Can't say at this point whether that's right or wrong AS FAR AS winning some states we need in 2028. I hate Silent Type Thursday #3
He's swinging to the center way too soon Blasphemer Thursday #4
2026 comes first. maxsolomon Yesterday #64
Ok. What is culturally normal? Raven123 Thursday #5
You know what it is. maxsolomon Yesterday #65
The implication of Newsom's other sentences is "it's anti-immigration" muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #68
First, please spell his name right. usonian Thursday #6
What is "wildly" successful? awesomerwb1 Yesterday #44
Bernie Sanders Packed an Arena in ... Utah usonian Yesterday #46
That's great awesomerwb1 Yesterday #48
You have to ask them. usonian Yesterday #50
It would be interesting data to have awesomerwb1 Yesterday #54
I caught some videos of the tour, and people said they were flipping. usonian Yesterday #63
"Proof"? awesomerwb1 Yesterday #66
Post removed Post removed Thursday #7
Exactly the point. We don't have to shove people's noses Bluetus Thursday #8
Most of those things aren't even popular among Democrats gulliver Yesterday #11
. WhiskeyGrinder Yesterday #28
It's part of health care. It doesn't have to be called out as a special issue. Fix healthcare for everyone, incl trans beaglelover Yesterday #74
When Republicans object to trans health care, should Democrats defend it, or fold because it's a niche cultural issue? WhiskeyGrinder Yesterday #79
They can just say trans health care is included in our health care plans. No need to dwell on it. beaglelover Yesterday #80
A lot of those things are exaggerated by the right wing JI7 Yesterday #13
I don't see data on those who don't vote, they're going after swing voters which are expensive iirc uponit7771 Yesterday #16
I can't think of a single Democrat who doesn't use pronouns. WhiskeyGrinder Yesterday #26
I'm a Democrat. I don't have my pronouns in my work signature. maxsolomon Yesterday #69
Well stated. Sounds like Sunday morning at my church. LAS14 Yesterday #53
When the right wants to strip trans people of rights, if not outright physically harm them TheProle Yesterday #94
N E W S O M Skittles Thursday #9
*WE* have to be less judgmental??? Skittles Thursday #10
Being judgemental isn't the problem LuvLoogie Yesterday #83
We have to do whatever we need to win JI7 Yesterday #12
His surname is spelled Newsom Niagara Yesterday #17
I applaud the OP for posting the Huff Post article in GD muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #18
There's sources posted here that are not reliable at all Niagara Yesterday #20
I don't see that the bit you added before excuses what he said muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #21
Oh, only RW'ers are judgemental on issues? Niagara Yesterday #24
In the grand scheme of things, yes, only Republican politicians are judgmental. muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #25
We are judgmental of Nazis and fascists, nothing wrong with that. They are judgmental of non whites- big problem Blues Heron Yesterday #29
Presidents Obama and Clinton triangulated. President Biden did not. Jose Garcia Yesterday #19
Biden stepped down after being hounded out by Clooney et al Blues Heron Yesterday #32
And a litany of party leaders. BannonsLiver Yesterday #38
Et al Blues Heron Yesterday #39
He was on his way to a lanndslide loss Jose Garcia Yesterday #41
He would have won -he's the only one to defeat Trump. Giving up incumbency was highly stupid. Blues Heron Yesterday #42
After that idiot took a pot shot at MFer, the die was cast. maxsolomon Yesterday #75
Dems need to find 80/20 issues they can hammer on GreatGazoo Yesterday #22
All my lefty family members are tired of the pronoun thing mainer Yesterday #23
Which Democratic candidates were demanding that? muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #27
I'm not referring to particular candidates mainer Yesterday #43
So this is not about Democrats, ie what Newsom was talking about. muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #47
... BannonsLiver Yesterday #35
Culturally normal another way to say the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few?? NoMoreRepugs Yesterday #30
Post removed Post removed Yesterday #31
He's not wrong. BannonsLiver Yesterday #33
So is he pushing a purity test for the party? Emile Yesterday #34
The opposite, actually. BannonsLiver Yesterday #36
LOL, I don't think so! Emile Yesterday #37
If you say so. BannonsLiver Yesterday #40
I know exactly what you're referring to. maxsolomon Yesterday #70
It's verboten to discuss but you are of course correct. BannonsLiver Yesterday #87
He's saying to drop the purity tests. Nixie Yesterday #45
I guess it depends on which side of the political spectrum Emile Yesterday #49
He's definitely not on the spectrum that alienates voters with Nixie Yesterday #51
As I said, it depends on what side of the political spectrum your on. Emile Yesterday #52
We've all seen enough of this insistence and labeling of Nixie Yesterday #55
See my post #56. nt LAS14 Yesterday #57
Purity tests, on which side of the spectrum are you talking about? Emile Yesterday #58
Centrist is really the obvious purity test. A way of smearing our candidates Nixie Yesterday #60
Then if centrist is a smear, why do some politicians call themselves centrist? Emile Yesterday #61
The purity test smear is obviously that being normal, as in not being Nixie Yesterday #71
Are you saying , if you are not a centrist, you are fringe? Emile Yesterday #73
Denying there is a political middle isn't "progressive." Nixie Yesterday #93
You still haven't answered my two questions. Emile Yesterday #95
I doubt you need my answers to any of your distractions to Nixie Yesterday #97
You just described a purity test! Thank you! Emile Yesterday #98
Your contrived set up was the purity test. Just run a candidate because Nixie 23 hrs ago #99
You do know there are 6 wings to the democratic party? Emile 23 hrs ago #100
Oh Nixie 23 hrs ago #101
Just being literal. Emile 23 hrs ago #102
Centrist/establishment/status quo/corporate Dems: anti-progressive, corrupt, elite Them. Us: Righteous victims. betsuni Yesterday #72
Curiosity here - not trying to make a point. LAS14 Yesterday #56
I think Democrats should make your point - that public Democrats are not leading with those issues muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #67
Gov. Newsom has been left behind in his judgement of what's "Culturally Normal" justaprogressive Yesterday #59
He's buying into RW framing again MustLoveBeagles Yesterday #62
He was doing well, now I'm not impressed. Emile Yesterday #89
I'm not either MustLoveBeagles Yesterday #90
Alienating part of the party is not going to win elections. Emile Yesterday #91
No it isn't MustLoveBeagles Yesterday #92
We lead with tolerance bucolic_frolic Yesterday #76
Focusing on the wrong things all the time. BlueTsunami2018 Yesterday #77
Would that also be the response when a member of that community asks one of our politicians how they feel about them? BannonsLiver Yesterday #81
If you think he's staking out territory well, what do you think his answer would be muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #84
He answered that in his podcast some were pressed about in March. BannonsLiver Yesterday #85
Give me a link muriel_volestrangler Yesterday #86
Newsom, no 'e'. RandySF Yesterday #78
very telling it has not been fixed Skittles Yesterday #88
Telling, or maybe I've been busy? Shipwack 12 hrs ago #108
IT STILL HAS NOT BEEN FIXED Skittles 1 hr ago #113
I, for one, will never vote for him in the primary if he runs. demmiblue Yesterday #96
Let's see... MorbidButterflyTat 23 hrs ago #103
But they work really hard on it, like washing machines. betsuni 22 hrs ago #105
+1, yes, so desperate to continue the coveted victimization Nixie 21 hrs ago #106
We've seen this attempt of gaslighting before Niagara 11 hrs ago #111
What are the rules to being more culturally normal? Emile 22 hrs ago #104
To me The Bopper 19 hrs ago #107
OP here. I deeply regret spelling the governor's name wrong. Shipwack 11 hrs ago #109
I wouldn't worry about it. I do not understand the hypersensitivity about the extra e. I certainly do not see it... QueerDuck 11 hrs ago #110
Thanks! nt Shipwack 4 hrs ago #112

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
14. I would say this is a great example of what he's talking about.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 01:32 AM
Yesterday

Centrist is a fringe idea of some kind of slur against normal people.

Silent Type

(12,278 posts)
3. Can't say at this point whether that's right or wrong AS FAR AS winning some states we need in 2028. I hate
Thu Dec 4, 2025, 10:49 PM
Thursday

we are in the position that some candidates— not just Newsom — believe the same thing. It’s sad, but plenty of election postmortems said the same.

There are places like NYC who will laugh at his “woke” awakening, but other places where it might make a 5% difference over next few years.

Blasphemer

(3,559 posts)
4. He's swinging to the center way too soon
Thu Dec 4, 2025, 10:53 PM
Thursday

IF we have elections in 2028, the GOP will be in tatars. It will be like 2008 (if not worse) for them. I'd hold off on making presumptions about what messaging will work 3 years from now. I suspect Dems will have great leeway in the kind of platform that can be successful.

maxsolomon

(38,011 posts)
64. 2026 comes first.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:32 PM
Yesterday

You don't take a seat from a Repuke incumbent by running to the left of left.

Obama didn't win by running as far left as possible. He won with charisma and unifying, aspirational rhetoric.

muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
68. The implication of Newsom's other sentences is "it's anti-immigration"
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:49 PM
Yesterday

See the longer quote in #17. Is that what "we all know what it is"? I hope not.

I really don't think that we all know what it is. I think it's deliberately vague.

usonian

(22,888 posts)
6. First, please spell his name right.
Thu Dec 4, 2025, 11:02 PM
Thursday

Second, I have been watching the wildly successful anti-oligarchy tour by Bernie and AOC.

It's not the cyclical economy, it's the concentration of over 90% of wealth in America by a few people.

And that's on the marquee.

At each rally issues of rights always come up and are well-received, even in red states.

The GOP is very much into what-about-ism, distracting from the (pardon the expression) elephant in the room. Oligarchical ownership of this country, its business and politicians. Like so.



EYES OFF THE PRIZE.

EYES OFF EPSTEIN.

So, I would say that he is urging the party to lead with the one biggest issue, that causes economic hardship, and which gets the oligarchs to manage the discussion away from it by making elections all about IMPORTANT social and rights issues, but using them as triggers for rage, their political operating system.

When you play back a Bernie-AOC rally, you get the impression that they are attacking the prime cause as job one, and are still extremely strong on social and rights issues.

The point is to win, and then good things come with winning.
You can't change their nuked "hearts and minds" but you can win and pass legislation for the betterment of society.
At that point. "It's the law"

In an early post, I quoted Ibram X. Kendi.

https://democraticunderground.com/100216524810

This is from the epilogue of "Stamped From the Beginning", by Ibram X Kendi.

Protesting against racist power and succeeding can never be mistaken for seizing power. Any effective solution to eradicating American racism must involve Americans committed to antiracist policies seizing and maintaining power over institutions, neighborhoods, counties, states, nations—the world. It makes no sense to sit back and put the future in the hands of people committed to racist policies, or people who regularly sail with the wind of self-interest, toward racism today, toward antiracism tomorrow. An antiracist America can only be guaranteed if principled antiracists are in power, and then antiracist policies become the law of the land, and then antiracist ideas become the common sense of the people, and then the antiracist common sense of the people holds those antiracist leaders and policies accountable.

And that day is sure to come. No power lasts forever. There will come a time when Americans will realize that the only thing wrong with Black people is that they think something is wrong with Black people. There will come a time when racist ideas will no longer obstruct us from seeing the complete and utter abnormality of racial disparities. There will come a time when we will love humanity, when we will gain the courage to fight for an equitable society for our beloved humanity, knowing , intelligently, that when we fight for humanity, we are fighting for ourselves. There will come a time. Maybe, just maybe, that time is now.


Lead with your strength, pound it in mercilessly, and good will come when you win.

Social betterment is the end, if not the means, in a corrosive environment.

Eyes on that prize. But you gotta win first. Got to get a little dirty to beat fascism and bigotry?
You bet.

EAT THE RICH
Watch "Specialty of the House" by Alfred Hitchcock Presents.
Spoiler article
https://thecannibalguy.com/2023/03/26/speciality-of-the-house/

Video here until taken down.
https://ok.ru/video/6896593865414

I tried NBC but nothing came up.
https://www.nbc.com/alfred-hitchcock-presents/video/the-specialty-of-the-house/9000245744

awesomerwb1

(4,953 posts)
44. What is "wildly" successful?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:48 AM
Yesterday

Are they bringing in new voters or just preaching to the choir?

As a centrist myself, center left, I would never vote for the right. But I know a few Bernie bro friends who voted for trump in 2016 (and possibly 2024) because they wanted to show the "establishment Dems".

usonian

(22,888 posts)
46. Bernie Sanders Packed an Arena in ... Utah
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:55 AM
Yesterday

The senator's Fighting Oligarchy tour alongside Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is drawing massive crowds — even in red states

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/bernie-sanders-aoc-crowds-red-states-1235316890/

https://archive.ph/qOZ7S

Bernie and AOC strongly supported Joe Biden during his presidency and campaigned vigorously for Harris and Walz.

There are outliers in any distribution of voters, and I strongly discourage "whataboutism". It's the favorite tool of the GOP.

Think "Willie Horton"

awesomerwb1

(4,953 posts)
48. That's great
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:00 AM
Yesterday

But the Dems have voters in every state including Utah. My question remains, are there a good number of new voters in those crowds, or just Dems/Bernie/AOC voters.

awesomerwb1

(4,953 posts)
54. It would be interesting data to have
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:17 AM
Yesterday

Doesn't mean much if they're just preaching to the choir.

usonian

(22,888 posts)
63. I caught some videos of the tour, and people said they were flipping.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:29 PM
Yesterday

Bernie's not into fake interviews.

Of course, no statistics were taken.

Proof is in the voting, which has seen gains in red states.

Would like to see lots more.

awesomerwb1

(4,953 posts)
66. "Proof"?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:44 PM
Yesterday

So you're attributing these gains in red states to Bernie?
There are cults on both side I guess. Hi ignore feature. Click

Response to Shipwack (Original post)

Bluetus

(2,067 posts)
8. Exactly the point. We don't have to shove people's noses
Thu Dec 4, 2025, 11:34 PM
Thursday

in our cultural issues. A lot of Americans would be willing to go along with "live and let live". We do more harm than good when we demand that people embrace our favorite cultural causes, repeating our mantra on a word-by-word basis.

We need to learn how to take "yes" for an answer. Or more accurately, to take "I can live with that" as a victory.

gulliver

(13,681 posts)
11. Most of those things aren't even popular among Democrats
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:10 AM
Yesterday

We really need to pay attention to Democratic voices. These things are not core issues. These so-called cultural issues distract us from our core mission as Democrats. Newsom is right.

People need health care. People need education and good nutrition. The climate needs to be addressed. These fringe issues need to get exactly the attention they deserve based on one person, one voice, one vote. Not "extra" attention based on a minority of extra loud types trying to portray themselves as sweetie pies. Attention equal to their democratically valid priority within the party.

WhiskeyGrinder

(26,083 posts)
28. .
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:11 AM
Yesterday
People need health care. People need education and good nutrition. The climate needs to be addressed. These fringe issues need to get exactly the attention they deserve
So is trans health care a health care issue or a fringe issue?

beaglelover

(4,405 posts)
74. It's part of health care. It doesn't have to be called out as a special issue. Fix healthcare for everyone, incl trans
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:24 PM
Yesterday

WhiskeyGrinder

(26,083 posts)
79. When Republicans object to trans health care, should Democrats defend it, or fold because it's a niche cultural issue?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:58 PM
Yesterday

beaglelover

(4,405 posts)
80. They can just say trans health care is included in our health care plans. No need to dwell on it.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:15 PM
Yesterday

JI7

(93,053 posts)
13. A lot of those things are exaggerated by the right wing
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 01:25 AM
Yesterday

they also pick out the most exteme bizarre types on social media and many of these types don't even support Democrats but they make it seem as if that's the position or view of most Democrats.

I think what Newsom is doing is taking control of the narrative.

uponit7771

(93,447 posts)
16. I don't see data on those who don't vote, they're going after swing voters which are expensive iirc
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:23 AM
Yesterday

maxsolomon

(38,011 posts)
69. I'm a Democrat. I don't have my pronouns in my work signature.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:57 PM
Yesterday

And my workplace encourages us to do so.

But yes, I use pronouns all the time...

LAS14

(15,449 posts)
53. Well stated. Sounds like Sunday morning at my church.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:16 AM
Yesterday

One doesn't have to pick these issues out to lead with in order to vote or act on the right side when they come up. But my church leads with them. All three.

TheProle

(3,853 posts)
94. When the right wants to strip trans people of rights, if not outright physically harm them
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:01 PM
Yesterday

Silence on the D side is complicity

LuvLoogie

(8,431 posts)
83. Being judgemental isn't the problem
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:34 PM
Yesterday

It is civil society's weak commitment to justice

The abuse this regime is perpetrating upon those the woke would champion is being normalized.

Peak America. It's disgusting.

Niagara

(11,268 posts)
17. His surname is spelled Newsom
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:54 AM
Yesterday

If an OP wants to accuse him of triangulating while misspelling his name I can't take the OP seriously.

The HuffPost also is NOT a credible source of news.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/huffington-post/


These media sources are moderate to strongly biased toward liberal causes through story selection and/or political affiliation. They may utilize strong loaded words (wording that attempts to influence an audience by using appeal to emotion or stereotypes), publish misleading reports, and omit information reporting that may damage liberal causes. Some sources in this category may be untrustworthy.





I'm going to insert Newsom's entire statement so anyone else can't pick and choose what context they want to share or dissect.


“I mean, I — you know, we could talk about why Kamala lost, which is separate. I mean, it’s part derivative of the larger narrative, but issues around inflation scars. We don’t talk enough about interest rates. We didn’t talk about incumbency. Issues related, you just had Bibi on, related to Israeli politics. Immigration, the border in particular, you could talk about all those things, not just 107 days, not just talk about Biden’s determination or lack thereof in terms of passing the baton. But I think there’s a broader narrative that we ought to address. That is, we have to be more culturally normal. We have to be a little less judgmental. We have to be a party that understands the importance and power of the border substantively and politically.”



You know what else Newsom said at The New York Times DealBook Summit?


"I need to wake everybody up," Newsom said at The New York Times DealBook Summit. "This is the normalization of deviancy, and it was becoming socialized, normalized."




"Call someone the R-word or 'piggy' and somehow it's just Trump being Trump," Newsom went on. "There's nothing normal about this. He's a man-child. It's unbecoming of the President of the United States. He's dressed up as the pope. He's acting like he's Superman. This is not normal."



If “we don’t democratize our economy, we’re not going to save democracy,” Newsom said.




muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
18. I applaud the OP for posting the Huff Post article in GD
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:04 AM
Yesterday

and am amazed that anyone on DU could be annoyed enough by that to go to the bother of looking up a website's opinion on it.

"Liberal" is good, here.

Niagara

(11,268 posts)
20. There's sources posted here that are not reliable at all
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:17 AM
Yesterday

To me it's important to have reliable sources. It always has been. It's not annoyance, it's called facts.


What Newsom said was taken out of context. At least insert his entire statement.


It's not helpful to the Democratic party if people pick and chose what context they want to share. Then the RW go with those talking points.




muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
21. I don't see that the bit you added before excuses what he said
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 08:39 AM
Yesterday

Simply, it's the right wing that are judgmental (of minorities, immigrants, LGBT - especially trans). Newsom saying "we have to be a little less judgmental" is giving in to the lies of the right wing.

Niagara

(11,268 posts)
24. Oh, only RW'ers are judgemental on issues?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 08:59 AM
Yesterday

There's been zero Democratic/progressive/liberal supporters/voters that are judgemental af.


Got it.

muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
25. In the grand scheme of things, yes, only Republican politicians are judgmental.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:05 AM
Yesterday

If you extend it to supporters/voters, then Democratic supporters or voters may be judgmental, but Republican supporters/voters are racist, misogynist, insane and murderous - as well as judgmental. But when Newsom is talking about what "we" should do, he is obviously talking about what the Democratic party and its candidates should do.

I hope you do get it. Newsom's remark does not help. He's wrong on this. It is indeed triangulation - giving in to the right wing attempt to shift the American center towards the fascism of Trump and Trumpists.

Blues Heron

(8,151 posts)
29. We are judgmental of Nazis and fascists, nothing wrong with that. They are judgmental of non whites- big problem
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:13 AM
Yesterday

Jose Garcia

(3,399 posts)
19. Presidents Obama and Clinton triangulated. President Biden did not.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:17 AM
Yesterday

Clinton and Obama were elected to second terms. Biden was not.

Jose Garcia

(3,399 posts)
41. He was on his way to a lanndslide loss
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:44 AM
Yesterday

No President with approval ratings that low has ever been reelected.

Blues Heron

(8,151 posts)
42. He would have won -he's the only one to defeat Trump. Giving up incumbency was highly stupid.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:57 AM
Yesterday

The voting booth is very different than some push poll with an agenda.

maxsolomon

(38,011 posts)
75. After that idiot took a pot shot at MFer, the die was cast.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:29 PM
Yesterday

Harris could have been Jesus of Nazareth; it wouldn't have made a difference.

GreatGazoo

(4,361 posts)
22. Dems need to find 80/20 issues they can hammer on
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 08:51 AM
Yesterday

It sounds like Newsom is saying that he doesn't want to defend some of the issues the GOP has attacked (?)

What is needed IMHO is a steady pivot toward new offense. "Trump is Hitler" will hit its expiration date in 2028, if not sooner. What is needed is for Dems to find the 80/20 issues and framing that put the GOP on defense and then to ride those to victory.

mainer

(12,470 posts)
23. All my lefty family members are tired of the pronoun thing
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 08:52 AM
Yesterday

We include 2 lesbians, a Democratic socialist and two old baby boomers. The whole "get my pronouns right or else" thing broke us. My son the college teacher got chewed out for forgetting a student's preferred pronouns. This demand for left wing purity ends up castigating those who have the best intentions but make mistakes. I understand where Newsom's coming from.

mainer

(12,470 posts)
43. I'm not referring to particular candidates
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:41 AM
Yesterday

I'm talking about "the liberal purity test" and how we Democrats need to firmly shut down conversation about which candidate is pure enough to support. MAGA has used it against us, and it's stirred up anger because people feel beleaguered about having to adhere to such strict standards. Certainly it's a problem on college campuses where teachers like my son got called into the administrative offices because he refused to add his pronouns to his email signature.

muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
47. So this is not about Democrats, ie what Newsom was talking about.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:56 AM
Yesterday

It's about an administrator on that college campus. And if it's about that administrator, why call for censoring ourselves? What has "which candidate is pure enough to support" got to do with the administrator?

If MAGA spread lies when they "used it against us", then stand up to the lies - say "that's not 'us', that's an idiot administrator, and his name is X - the Republicans are lying that this is a Democratic policy". Don't fall for the Republican BS - fight against it.

Response to Shipwack (Original post)

BannonsLiver

(20,171 posts)
40. If you say so.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 09:22 AM
Yesterday

Last edited Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:25 AM - Edit history (2)

Real purity tests might be something like getting pressured into giving an answer to a question that could end up featured on a damaging TV ad, or other form of messaging down the road because it was so out of step with the mainstream, even if the person giving that answer had good intentions.

maxsolomon

(38,011 posts)
70. I know exactly what you're referring to.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 01:02 PM
Yesterday

That ad 100% struck a chord with "culturally normal" voters. It's willful blindness to refuse to acknowledge it.

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
45. He's saying to drop the purity tests.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:52 AM
Yesterday

He is saying to quit pushing purity tests.

The purity tests have alienated voters, Then we lose. So he is saying to not be so judgmental over purity tests and alienating voters.

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
51. He's definitely not on the spectrum that alienates voters with
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:08 AM
Yesterday

purity tests.

The resistance to this common sense suggestion is very noticeable in this thread where people want to attack him for not being pure enough.

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
55. We've all seen enough of this insistence and labeling of
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:21 AM
Yesterday

politicians that is based on nothing but purity tests.

Emile

(39,782 posts)
58. Purity tests, on which side of the spectrum are you talking about?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:24 AM
Yesterday

The one that keeps insisting we can't win in red districts unless we run a centrist?

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
60. Centrist is really the obvious purity test. A way of smearing our candidates
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:57 AM
Yesterday

for not being pure enough.

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
71. The purity test smear is obviously that being normal, as in not being
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 01:57 PM
Yesterday

fringe, is a smear. This is a circular nonsensical disinformation campaign now, as the smear is that leading from the center is somehow a bad thing. Hence the smearing of most good Democrats. It’s not a bad thing to not alienate most voters who are in the center.

Emile

(39,782 posts)
73. Are you saying , if you are not a centrist, you are fringe?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:07 PM
Yesterday

When someone says we can't win in a red district unless the candidate is centrist, isn't that smearing progressives?

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
93. Denying there is a political middle isn't "progressive."
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:00 PM
Yesterday

It’s just denial. Denying political realities isn’t “progressive.” It’s just a disinformation campaign based on purity tests.

Emile

(39,782 posts)
95. You still haven't answered my two questions.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 05:03 PM
Yesterday

1. If you are not a centrist (Political Middle), you are fringe?

2. When someone says we can't win in a red district unless the candidate is centrist, isn't that smearing progressives?

3. Where did I deny political realities?

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
97. I doubt you need my answers to any of your distractions to
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:34 PM
Yesterday

common sense and simple political truths. The insistence on victimization because the wrong candidate in the wrong district is just plain dumb politics doesn’t need anyone’s time to explain.

Emile

(39,782 posts)
98. You just described a purity test! Thank you!
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:48 PM
Yesterday

Wrong candidate in the wrong district is just plain dumb politics (according to one wing of the party).

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
99. Your contrived set up was the purity test. Just run a candidate because
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:14 PM
23 hrs ago

of magic words we like with no regard to actually winning. That’s a beauty contest, not a political campaign.

Newsom is focused on actually winning. Yay.

Emile

(39,782 posts)
100. You do know there are 6 wings to the democratic party?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:23 PM
23 hrs ago

Showing disapproval to one of the wings, is not a way to win elections.

betsuni

(28,586 posts)
72. Centrist/establishment/status quo/corporate Dems: anti-progressive, corrupt, elite Them. Us: Righteous victims.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:05 PM
Yesterday

Redefining and weaponizing words to create Us versus Them division. Nearly every day Jeffries or Schumer are nitpicked to purity hell and back and Democrats lavishly insulted.

Centrist is the new establishment as an insult but it just doesn't sound as impressive, could be the name of a multivitamin supplement.

LAS14

(15,449 posts)
56. Curiosity here - not trying to make a point.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:22 AM
Yesterday

For sure members of the left (my church, see post up thread) can be characterized as leading with issues like pronouns and land acknowledgement, but what public Democrats do? I think even AOC and Bernie lead with economic issues these days.

So where does the whole party get this reputation? If it's not based on fact, how can we fight it?

As I said, genuine question, not a position in an argument.

muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
67. I think Democrats should make your point - that public Democrats are not leading with those issues
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 12:44 PM
Yesterday

or indeed making them minor issues (that is, saying other people should be paying more attention to them; I'm sure many Democrats have "specified their pronouns" somewhere, but there's a difference between that and saying that everyone ought to do it).

When a MAGA talking point is not based on fact, say so - say they're making stuff up. And say that means they are not trustworthy.

bucolic_frolic

(53,558 posts)
76. We lead with tolerance
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:44 PM
Yesterday

but get pasted with extreme micro-examples of its implications.

We should keep returning to the broad princples instead.

BlueTsunami2018

(4,800 posts)
77. Focusing on the wrong things all the time.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 02:53 PM
Yesterday

It’s class, class, class. That should be the beginning and the end of it. Working class vs. ruling class is all there really is.

Any time you’re asked about any of this stupid, divisive, culture war shit, you answer with class.

“How do you feel about transgender people?”

“They’re in the working class and it’s all of us against the ruling class. We need universal healthcare, education, housing and employment. There’s no reason why all the wealth should go to the very few when the people who create that wealth get nothing.”

“Black lives matter vs. all lives matter?”

“Improving conditions for the working class is what we’re focused on. Ending poverty with universal healthcare, housing, education and employment. There’s no reason, in the richest country in the world, that everyone shouldn’t have their basic needs met.”

Name the culture war issue, that’s the answer. Always spin it back to working class and improving their lives.

But these politicians continue to buy into the division. Because the people who buy them want it that way.

BannonsLiver

(20,171 posts)
81. Would that also be the response when a member of that community asks one of our politicians how they feel about them?
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:15 PM
Yesterday

Somehow I’m not sure that would go over very well in that community, which is why what you’re proposing doesn’t quite work. Sounds great though. But in practice it doesn’t cover all the bases. I’m glad Newsom is staking out this territory now. It’s one of many reasons why I plan on voting for him should he run.

muriel_volestrangler

(105,367 posts)
84. If you think he's staking out territory well, what do you think his answer would be
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:47 PM
Yesterday

to a transgender or Black person who asks him how he feels about them?

"We have to be more culturally normal. We have to be a little less judgmental. We have to be a party that understands the importance and power of the border substantively and politically." ?

Do you really think that "covers all the bases", for a transgender or Black person?

BannonsLiver

(20,171 posts)
85. He answered that in his podcast some were pressed about in March.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 03:51 PM
Yesterday

It doesn’t sound like you’re going to be voting for him in the UK Democratic primary lol.

Shipwack

(2,955 posts)
108. Telling, or maybe I've been busy?
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 07:02 AM
12 hrs ago

I deeply regret the error. I’ve tried to change it a couple of times, but I keep getting an error message in tiny script that I can’t read on my phone.

Nothing nefarious about it not being corrected. I’ll endeavor to be more careful in the future.

Skittles

(168,906 posts)
113. IT STILL HAS NOT BEEN FIXED
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 05:57 PM
1 hr ago

WTF

if there's an "issue with that" ask the Admin

DONE HERE

demmiblue

(39,072 posts)
96. I, for one, will never vote for him in the primary if he runs.
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 06:03 PM
Yesterday

In the general, I always vote D.

MorbidButterflyTat

(4,019 posts)
103. Let's see...
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 07:39 PM
23 hrs ago

Three tiny, cryptic paragraphs taken out of context critical of an effective Democrat. Hm.

Purity testing 101. Fastest, easiest way to divide Dems.

So predictable it's boring.

Nixie

(17,930 posts)
106. +1, yes, so desperate to continue the coveted victimization
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 10:01 PM
21 hrs ago

when reality is this has all gone unchallenged far too long. Thank goodness for Newsom daring to start critiquing the critiquers.

Niagara

(11,268 posts)
111. We've seen this attempt of gaslighting before
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 07:26 AM
11 hrs ago

It's pathetic, especially when the gaslighting attempts happen on DU.


There's two manipulators in this thread I'll have to watch out for in the future.


The Bopper

(271 posts)
107. To me
Fri Dec 5, 2025, 11:16 PM
19 hrs ago

It means we'll never get enough middle of the road people back, if we insist that all we are is anything but white males should be included in the conversation.. In my area anything guns, loses, no matter how right it is.. Point being we can't include everyone if we exclude anyone who doesn't agree with us on one point who may agree on 10 others..

Shipwack

(2,955 posts)
109. OP here. I deeply regret spelling the governor's name wrong.
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 07:07 AM
11 hrs ago

No disrespect intended.

I’m not perfect, and haven’t had enough time to correct the mistake. I promise to be more careful in the future.

I’ve tried fixing the spelling, but I keep getting an error message in tiny print that I can’t decipher.

QueerDuck

(742 posts)
110. I wouldn't worry about it. I do not understand the hypersensitivity about the extra e. I certainly do not see it...
Sat Dec 6, 2025, 07:22 AM
11 hrs ago

as being any sort of "disrespect". The spelling Newsome (with an 'e') is significantly more common as a surname than Newsom (without an 'e'), at least in the United States.

According to data from the 2010 United States Census:
-- Newsome was the 1491st most common surname, belonging to approximately 23,958 individuals.
-- Newsom was the 3218th most common surname, belonging to approximately 11,218 individuals.

The spelling without the 'e' (Newsom) is often considered a variant of the more common Newsome spelling.

In my life, every Newsome I've known (friends, colleagues) all four of them... have had the e spelling. This seems like such a silly thing for people to get so upset over, or for anyone to be suspicious about you. It's a chat room, not a thesis paper. Not a wikipedia page. There was no confusion who you were referring to (or should I say "to whom you were referring"... you never know... I might upset someone.)

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