What happens if the military revolt against the orange asshole

[libtodeath]

Where does our country end up
I am hoping that in this extraordinary and dangerous for our future time some in the Pentagon are talking about it

[no_hypocrisy]

1. IOW, who's in charge (of The Military)?

[Irish_Dem]

8. The US president is in charge of the US military.

In our country, the military is under civilian command, the Commander in Chief is the
sitting POTUS.

[no_hypocrisy]

10. But if the military revolts, who gives them commands they'll obey?

[Irish_Dem]

14. Doubtful the US military will revolt against a sitting US president.

We have seen no American institution to date stand up to Trump.
In fact the opposite, everyone is on bended knee to him.

But for the sake of argument, we don't know the answer to your question.

There is a hierarchy in the US military, Secretary of Defense who is aways a civilian,
joint chiefs who are military, etc.

But if some of the military revolts I supposed lower ranked officers could assume command.

The US military is the most powerful military force in the world.
It is doubtful a small group of soldiers would take on this force.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

35. Kent State: Twenty-eight National Guard soldiers fired about 67 rounds over 13 seconds, killing 4 students, acquitted

The Kent State shootings (also known as the Kent State massacre or May 4 massacre[3][4][5]) were the killing of four and wounding of nine unarmed college students by the Ohio National Guard on the Kent State University campus. The shootings took place on May 4, 1970, during a rally opposing the expanding involvement of the Vietnam War into Cambodia by United States military forces as well as protesting the National Guard presence on campus and the draft. Twenty-eight National Guard soldiers fired about 67 rounds over 13 seconds, killing four students and wounding nine others, one of whom suffered permanent paralysis.

-snip-
Eight of the shooters were charged with depriving the students of their civil rights, but were acquitted in a bench trial.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings

[Irish_Dem]

36. This has zero to do with the OP topic.

Kent State was not a revolt of the US military against the US gov't.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

44. It showed that 28 soldiers were willing to shoot and kill protestors.

And they got away with it. I don’t recall that the person who was in charge of this unit got in any trouble. So people who think there would be soldiers who would refuse an order need to think twice. Who will be the top military person now and who will be left after “The Purge?”

[Irish_Dem]

45. Yes it is a very isolated example of soldiers willing to kill civilians.

Of course the NG is not a part of the hard core military.
Not as well trained or disciplined obviously.

Off hand I cannot think of regular US military killing American civilians.

[allegorical oracle]

37. Just watched the film "Seven Days in May" last nite. It's about a military coup

against the president. Leading the coup was the head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, but Senators were also involved.

No spoiler as to what happens because it's worth everyone's viewing. Read that it was one of Obama's fav films, too.

[sarisataka]

2. The only military revolt I expect to see

is a refusal to follow illegal orders.

The only military revolt I want to see is a refusal to follow illegal orders.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

4. And, it doesn't matter if a Been A Dick Donald defense secretary gives the illegal order,

the line officers and NCO's would be tasked with carrying out the illegal orders and I highly doubt that many would obey.

[JustAnotherGen]

7. I hope and pray you are right

Thank you

[MarineCombatEngineer]

9. I'm sure there would be a few,

but for the most part, most would refuse to obey an illegal order and the few that did would be quickly rounded up by the security forces.

[JustAnotherGen]

18. My grampa

Was in the Military Police Corp at the end of WW2. Good folks fill those ranks.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

20. I served 2 year as a Marine cop before returning to my original MOS,

but during that 2 years, I met a lot of good Marines serving as cops.

[wnylib]

38. But, if the orders were made legal?

Would the military obey a legal but immoral command?

Not an idle question. Happened in Germany. When German law was changed to make Jews no longer citizens and to mark them as traitors, the military and courts carried out the new laws.

[Bettie]

17. For some reason

you saying this makes me feel slightly better.

Thanks, I really needed this today.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

32. It's not what happened at Kent State when they shot and killed protesting students

So I’m not confident that it couldn’t happen again. Except this time, a lot more people will think it’s good. Back then, people were appalled I think we have a good number of people and an Attorney General who will approve it.

[wnylib]

43. Not everyone was appalled. Quite a few said

that the students "asked for it" and got what they deserved.

Nixon was unpopular with the youth, but popular enough with voters to get elected and to have their support. Many of those Nixon supporters believed that protesting against a war that the US was fighting was treasonous.

[FarPoint]

11. That is probably why tRump

said he will purge out military Generals.... said a week or so ago...

[._.]

51. Nailed it!

Military personnel, officer or enlisted, are under NO obligation to obey an illegal/unconstitutional order.

[Sympthsical]

3. Talking about what? Revolting?

Or how to handle a revolt?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

6. Revolting against an illegal order. nt

[libtodeath]

12. We are in an unprecedented time

Everyone says the military has plans for everything so am guessing maybe a situation where a president is beholden to a foreign power

[Sympthsical]

16. What are you asking for?

Feels like you're talking around something. They military can (and should) resist any illegal orders given.

I guess my question is are you asking if they'll take any direct action against the President?

[libtodeath]

19. No I am not

What if he gives a legal order such as a nuke strike on Iran or similar without any thought of the consequences.
That would be a perfect way to provoke Putin to do the same against Ukraine.

[Sympthsical]

21. The military would probably revolt in such a case

I know the rhetoric is we're the Fourth Reich now. But probably not. The military is unlikely to go along with anything crazy.

[libtodeath]

22. Which leads to what

They refuse a legal order because it is crazy and bad what can he do,relieve command by his word until he finds someone that will do it?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

23. They wouldn't refuse a legal order and if the vast majority of line officers and NCO's refuse

to obey an illegal order, then it would be interesting just how Been A Dick would react and how the line officers and NCO's would counter react.
There would be a few that would follow such orders, but the vast majority will not and it's the line officers and NCO's who actually get things done and without them, nothing happens.

[Sympthsical]

26. Hope there are people around that won't do it

Quite famously, Nixon got drunk and started looking around for tactical nuke targets in North Korea. Kissinger got on the phone and told the Joint Chiefs to just pretend they didn't hear it until the President sobered up.

The military has ways of being quite . . . flexible when they think a President is being weird.

To be honest, I try to worry about things that are imminent or likely. There are too many things we have to worry about right now that I'm not going to go conjuring hypotheticals to keep me awake at night.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

27. You are absolutely correct,

the military may get the orders, but they have a unique way of disobeying while not actually disobeying such orders, I know, I did it a few times during my career.

[Sympthsical]

28. LOL

The veterans in my family have stories as well.

I appreciate your insight in this thread, because you clearly know far more on the topic and can speak more authoritatively.

[JustAnotherGen]

5. They won't

I just don't have any faith in any institutions right now. I believe they will 'follow orders'.

A very good friend has a son down in Texas that turned traitor on his mom and sisters on November 5th. . . He's an Army Ranger who was telling his mom he wanted Tulsi Gabbard in 2016.

And he was a star student. Makes no sense. But if you can turn your back on your own flesh and blood - you can turn it on your own people.

[Xavier Breath]

39. "They won't"

This.

[gab13by13]

13. It had better be a huge revolt

TSF sent a message to former military about criticizing him. He threatened to bring them back and court martial them, but they would also lose their pensions.

[ChicagoRonin]

15. I don't see a revolt happening. Infighting maybe.

I read somewhere there are 60,000 immigrants serving in the U.S. military, many non-citizen permanent residents.
Undocumented immigrants are generally not allowed to serve, but I guess there are still some in there.

All of them would find their careers under threat or encounter harassment under what the Trump administration is planning. Not to mention female service members (especially officers) and the reported 16,000 self-identified LGBT service members.

[EndlessWire]

47. He's planning a purge of the military

a la Russia. I bet that he will require a loyalty pledge to himself, else you can get out.

Do you remember, back in his first term, how he tried to meet someone in private, and he tried to get that person to pledge or sign a loyalty oath? I can't quite remember it, except for the loyalty oath part. He has already tried that. Now he will require it.

I don't think it is a coincidence that Russia is purging his generals, and the Orange Hellbeast is going to do the same. I wouldn't be at all surprised if tRump sends our troops to fight against Ukraine. Russia can't prevail with NK troops. He could with ours, but that would be messed up bigtime. Our guys will not fight Russian meat style. They would probably turn on Russia.

At any rate, it is odd that tRump is announcing his intentions. Perhaps he is just letting Russia know.

[JR11]

24. A shattering reality

I'm reluctant to share this amidst all the despair. The military is mixed on this, but the majority will likely show loyalty to the Trumpian movement; that new perceptual paradigm where there is no right and wrong, only might makes right.

What we have long since ascribed as evil applies full fold in that might makes right way of living, and it has been made more than evident that is the course direction we are all now heading.

I cannot impart just how I'm feeling. Outside of our countries democratic people rising up together to defend our future, there is nothing else.

I'm sure there are still people refusing to take in that reality, or refusing to grasp the idea that their comfort zones couldn't possibly be taken from them, but time will tell.

If that reality is allowed to take power on inauguration day... well, at this point, I'm not dismissing any scenarios regarding outright unlawfulness, as it's not out of the question that the norms will be kicked aside by sway or force. What I'm getting at is, in a fascistic regime they'll be looking to establish might and power immediately, so that means they'll be looking to commit atrocities to permeate fear and deflate the spirit of the country. Aside from his already stated targets, I'm afraid they'll be making an example out of the marginalized.

Where the world is finding itself really comes down to the heart. It comes down to individuals and what they recognise as unshakable moral standards and human decency, or how far they've given themselves over to obeying the sway of unbriddled power.

[Dan]

25. Actually, there was a time

The American Civil War where the military basically split apart based on political beliefs. One went North and the other South.

The real concern is the idea of a purge of the General Officers by Trump - and the message that will send to the other General Officers.

The rank and file will for the most part follow the orders of their commanders (with a few exceptions), because when you’re in the military you’re really not attuned to what’s happening in the civilian world.

The Military has already started talking to Trump via the retired General Officers. The idea that a TV host will now be the Sec. Of Defense - I am sure is also a concern.

I guess, I would say ‘ Watch the Colonels’.

[milestogo]

29. They would have to go all the way.

[Ranting Randy]

30. What happens if they don't? - Even more scary

[LogDog75]

31. I'm a retired AF Senior Master Sergeant (E-8)

I retired from the AF after 28 years of active duty service. The question of what is an illegal order is something we faced. In most cases, the person giving the illegal order was informed by the person(s) given the order why it was illegal and the person giving the order backed down when they had the correct information. If the person giving the illegal order didn't back down it was elevated up the chain-of-command where it was squashed and the person giving the order had to explain themself to their immediate supervisor or commander.

As for DonOld Trump giving the military orders to go into the streets and round-up illegal immigrants I believe the Chiefs of Staffs for the military branches will try to push back on the order saying it violates Posse Comitatus which is using the military for law enforcement. Posse Comitatus does allow use of military resources to support law enforcement such as providing troops in a support capacity at the border or for drug interdiction. Although the Chiefs of Staff may resist the orders I have no doubt DonOld Trump would replace any one of them if they refused to follow his orders. Going down the chain-of-command, many officers would resist as best they could the orders and if they refused they'd too be replaced. Unfortunately, there are enough officers and enlisted who would have no problem doing whatever DonOld Trump wanted them to do. I wouldn't put it past him to require military officers to sign a loyalty oath to him.

So, as far as a military revolt, no, there wouldn't be one but IMO, it would not only tear the military apart but it would severely damage it for years making the U.S. weaker militarily. In addition, the services are having a hard time meeting their recruitment quotas and this would further negatively impact recruiting. If that happens, then look to having the Draft, which I oppose, return.

[Skittles]

50. I don't understand how ANYONE it the military can support Cadet Bonespurs

I say this as an USAF veteran - IT MAKES ME SICK.

[Wounded Bear]

33. I doubt there will be any active "revolution." Wouldn't surprise me, though...

if there are some foot dragging and fudging coming in the not too distant future.

Military guys know how to play the system and fuck things up surreptitiously.

[maxsolomon]

34. What happens if my Aunt had balls?

This isn't going to happen.

[Skittles]

52. why would your aunt want THE most delicate body part?

makes no sense

[Trueblue1968]

40. Lock him up !!!!!! French Revolution Trump like the french did to king louie !!!!!!

[totodeinhere]

42. So you propose sending him to the guillotine and decapitating him?

LOL

[Trueblue1968]

48. Perhaps send him to St. Helena or Elba for the rest of his life like they did to Napoleon

Hey, this is my fantasy. If you don't pike it too bad.

[totodeinhere]

41. The military is not going to revolt against him.

n/t

[Meowmee]

46. Good question

We may find out.

[Luz]

49. They won't. The military has been brainwashed for

years. Starting with Rush Limbaugh and continuing with fox news. They've been blasted with rw crap for years.