Did Biden do the right thing by meeting with Trump?

[kentuck]

Just to show the American people that the Democrats are a Party of law and order and follow our Constitution?

In my opinion, it looked rather impotent inviting the guy to the White House that would not do you the same favor 4 years ago. The guy that tried to overturn your election with violence. The guy that does not want your help or your favors. Thank you very much. Keep your money. We will pay for our own transition.

But thanks for groveling, just the same.

It may have been the right thing to do but it looked weak, in my opinion.

[Prairie Gates]

1. Yes...Biden's constant refrain has been "You can't just love your country when you win"

Trump won. He won convincingly and fully. If it's a problem, it's a problem with democracy itself. But Biden is being consistent with his positions and with his institutionalism.

Popper's "Paradox of Tolerance" is well known, but it might extend to a "Paradox of Institutionalism" as well: the institutionalist must accept the destroyers of institutions if they have been admitted legitimately into the management of the institution. Because the legitimacy of the institution is more important for the institutionalist than its survival.

That's what's on display here: institutionalism mistaking means for ends, perhaps. Or, as they used to say, the Constitution as a suicide pact.

[Ilikepurple]

30. I think Popper would side with saving the institution in some cases maybe not this.

I do get your point though.
“We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant. We should claim that any movement preaching intolerance places itself outside the law, and we should consider incitement to intolerance and persecution as criminal, in the same way as we should consider incitement to murder, or to kidnapping, or to the revival of the slave trade, as criminal.” — Karl Raimund Popper, The Open Society and Its Enemies

[Prairie Gates]

38. Oh, certainly Popper would

He resolved the paradox of tolerance as merely apparent. Biden will not do the same with institutionalism.

[Ilikepurple]

41. You are definitely correct

I mistakenly thought you believed Biden was trapped by Popper2.0’s Paradox of Institutionalism.

[harumph]

2. Yes, it looked weak.

Biden has missed the plot. Still reaching across the aisle as it were...

[Ocelot II]

3. Biden is an old school, institutionalist guy. This is the way honorable people behaved

in the old days, when politicians were at least occasionally civilized. He doesn't know any other way to behave, and he probably didn't want one of his last official acts to be that of a graceless boor like the one who will succeed him. I don't think it was a sign of weakness, just an example of a guy not being a dick.

[July]

21. And the NYT today continues its sanewashing re the transition:

“When Mr. Biden was inaugurated 14 days later [after J6], Mr. Trump did not greet him at the White House, ride with him to the Capitol or take his seat on the stage. Instead, he flew on Marine One from the White House to a jet waiting to take him to his Florida estate.”

No mention whatsoever of Trump’s firing the White House staff and locking the Bidens out of the White House. Apparently, we ordinary people know something that the NYT journalists didn’t, OR they tried to limit the truth about Trump’s petty, childish behavior.

[polichick]

4. Anyone else would have been arrested and jailed until trial in the docs case...

Then found guilty on many counts - stealing, hiding, obstruction, selling secrets, etc.

There would have been no campaign.

Fact: Biden is president. He has the option of quickly replacing Garland with someone who respects the rule of law and honors the oath he or she took. What should have happened could still happen (except the campaign).

Since Biden has made an attempt to normalize the situation with his WH meet and greet rather than use his final weeks in office pulling out all the stops to protect the Constitution, it seems clear that a deal has been cut with the oligarchs.

That meeting was not about following the Constitution or keeping the oath - it was either an attempt to buy time or complete surrender.

Biden has a choice: Save this republic or accept as his legacy the loss of it.

[Ocelot II]

5. How do you think a replacement AG could do any of those things before 1/20?

[Silent Type]

7. If there were evidence he sold secrets, we'd have him.

[onenote]

16. Lots of DUers have that evidence, apparently. But for some reason they don't share it.

[prodigitalson]

14. "pull out all the stops to protect the constitution"

The Constitution calls for a peaceful transfer of power to the winner of the election.

[Farmer-Rick]

35. It also called for no oath to a dictator by the military

But, Trump's going ahead with that.

It also called for Trump not to be an insurrectionist. But he is and a felon to boot.

It also calls for the good Behaviour of sitting Supreme Court justices.

It also called for the speedy trial by jury of criminals. But it seems criminals in our country never even see an indictment let alone a speedy trial.

But the more I think of it, the more I realize that a huge amount of laws based on our Constitution have been violated by everyone who will be in power on 20 Jan. And the US failure to hold these criminals to account has led to this fascist takeover.

Even the Democratic party had their part to play in the creation of this new fascist regime. And their final act is to handover a functioning government to the fascists for dismantling and destruction.

I hope the idiot Trump humpers enjoyed their one last vote......you will never have to vote again.

[prodigitalson]

39. You honestly want Joe Biden to declare himself a dictator?

[Hope22]

6. Was President Obama wrong too when he ushered in the thief propped up by Russia!

Or did he follow protocol? I remember a time for private conversation with T. We don’t know what was said. I don’t know what was said on President Biden’s visit this week but I’m sure it was not easy for the President. It is not his job to certify this election. His job is to do his job. That is what he was doing this week. The man is a puddle. That is what is left of him after he tried to pull this country together. Kick him if you want to but I will not be judging him.

[CommonHumanity]

8. Resounding NO-NT

[defacto7]

9. I keep coming back to Biden's address

right after the election. Directly after saying we will have a peaceful transition of power, he said, "because Americans deserve what they voted for." I'd like to think it was a layered statement as in, you get what you voted for so eat it.

In which case, why not follow standard protocol.

[ProudMNDemocrat]

10. No matter what Joe did, he was going to get pilloried for it by the Press...what's left of it.

The fact that Melania did not show up, shows disdain for the position she is in once again and her not caring about anything. The "Barron is in NYC going to college thing" is a plausible excuse for her. I couldn't care less about either one of them.

But Joe is going to go out with HONOR and the Presidential Historians are going to write about him in ways that will rile up tRump's anger. He goes after Joe and Jill the way he is planning to, as well as the Obama's and Hillary, the animosity of him will only grow. The world indeed is watching and tRump is not going to be welcomed anywhere.

The cordial welcome by Joe was what was expected of him. It showed the world that Joe has CHARACTER and DIGNITY, while tRump does not.

[Johonny]

11. He's not in a position of strength

His own party abandoned him. His party lost the election, house, senate and presidency anyway. He is a lame duck with little power to move any final policies through.

And the guy replacing him that he hosted wants to put him in jail for the rest of his life. So, I can see why he might humor the soon to be dictator in chief even if he doesn't respect him at all. Everyone knows flattering Trump keeps him happy. It's the only thing he wants. Playing Trump is easy. And Biden played him just fine given Bidens exposure.

[the_liberal_grandpa]

12. ABSOLUTELY NOT!

[Shrek]

13. I saw some pics where he looked jovial and relaxed

Not really the right look if you actually think Trump is an existential threat to the nation.

[beaglelover]

25. Exactly! If Trump is such as horrible human and the next Hitler, why was Joe so upbeat meeting with him yesterday?

[Jinny]

33. Watch the video of Joe's comments last week on the election results

He came out absolutely beaming with a thumbs up and fist pumping in the air.

Weird stuff to me.

[sarisataka]

15. Does this mean Biden has dropped

off everyone's "Best President in my lifetime" list?

There is a lot of derision being directed at the man we hailed for over three years

[onenote]

18. +1

[DFW]

32. Second that

Biden showed class in a situation where he could have ducked out completely.

Trump can mock him for it later, but that would only further highlight Biden’s class vs. Trump’s lack of it.

If “respect is the ultimate currency,” as has often been quoted, Trump is going to have to go into deep debt yet again to get solvent—it’s something he craves, but lacks, and has no clue how to obtain it. The more you try to take it by force, the faster it eludes you, because it is not for sale, a concept many do not seem to grasp.

Ustedes vencerán, porque poseen la fuerza bruta, pero no convencerán.—Miguel de Unamuno lecturing the Spanish fascists at the onset of the Spanish Civil War in 1936. Nothing has changed but the date in the history books.

[Ocelot II]

19. People are looking for someone to blame,

and some are outraged that Biden smiled instead of kicking Trump in the nuts. I'll bet it just about killed him to have to smile and do the normal protocol stuff that Trump, always the poor loser, wouldn't do for him last time. But we aren't in his shoes, feeling the necessity of sucking it up and trying to preserve what's left of civilized political behavior. I haven't changed my mind about him. Some people think it was a mistake for him to announce a run for a second term instead of stepping away so there could be a primary election in the normal course of things. And maybe it was, but hindsight and $2 gets you a double-skim latte at Starbucks. He accomplished some great things, most of which he didn't get proper credit for, and I hope that when the dust settles and the fingers stop pointing he'll finally get that credit. And basic courtesy is always a good thing even when shown to people who don't deserve it. We don't have to be like Trump.

[msongs]

23. one suspects there is nothing at starbucks for $2 lol nt

[hawkeye21]

17. Hell no.

Doing anything to make Trump appear "normal" is a disgrace and an affront to all decent people everywhere. Trump should be shunned at every opportunity. Joe made a mistake. He and the rest of the Dem leadership had better not do it again, and no way should any of them show up at the farce scheduled for Jan. 20, 2025, on the spot where Trump--about four years earlier--led an insurrection, a coup that took those four years to finally succeed.

[kentuck]

20. And stand and applaud...

...his every ridiculous proclamation.

[LSparkle]

29. Wonder if W will show up for some more "really weird shit" like last time

I hope Barack and Michelle have other plans.

[msongs]

22. laughing it up with trump while the usa went up in flames in the fireplace? that meeting? nt

[LSparkle]

31. Fireplace may be like a lapel pin ...

It’s a barometer of the “temperature” at the WH.

[Mr. Sparkle]

24. I wouldnt do it , but Joe is a way better man than me.

[onecaliberal]

26. No. NO NO NO NO

[MaryMagdaline]

27. Yes. Trump likes people to be nice to him.

He has no moral compass. Joe needs to leave the door open. Never know when asshole might call him.
Joe was in the senate for years, knows to keep communications open.

[MineralMan]

28. The "Right" Thing Is Not Always the "Smart" Thing.

[Doodley]

34. Biden's first job is to protect America. Did he do that in this instance?

[EndlessWire]

36. I don't think it looked weak.

Biden did what he had to do. He might have been seething inside. We don't know. tRump is a villain. Biden knows that. I doubt very much that he enjoyed that in any way. Sometimes strength is found in doing something extremely distasteful.

Biden loves the US. He had to behave that way so we don't hear the ugliness from tRump. Which we are going to hear, anyway. Anytime something tRump wants doesn't work out, we are going to hear about the "Biden/Harris failed administration." But, not because of this.

I hate Trump with a passion. Just to be clear.

[obnoxiousdrunk]

37. Yes.

[BannonsLiver]

40. I was okay with it but from here on out I don't want to see any more conciliatory gestures for these maniacs.

Biden is from a time when these things were relevant and he wants to maintain some norms. But moving forward we need to learn to be as brutal and ruthless as they are when applying power, should we ever get it back again.

[karynnj]

42. Yes he did. He stayed true to himself

I think Biden did what seemed right to him. He is not Trump who flew to Florida rather than go Biden's inauguration. He has respect for the government and the pageantry of the transition of power. He may consider it dishonorable to not do what is customary.

[4th gen blue]

43. Yes. Joe was the Bigger man.

And he proved it. Trump looked like a smug jerk.