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WhiskeyGrinder

(23,830 posts)
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 09:33 PM Nov 9

The Media Can't Figure Out Why Some Racist Israeli Soccer Hooligans Were Beaten Up

https://defector.com/the-media-cant-figure-out-why-some-racist-israeli-soccer-hooligans-were-beaten-up

After a few hours and several substantial edits, the Times' article about Thursday's events has something approaching a comprehensive picture of what went down—though to get it, you still have to patch together a timeline from the facts scattered throughout the article. It all started on Wednesday, the day before the match, when a sizable number of Maccabi fans arrived into Amsterdam to watch their team take on Ajax in the Europa League. Coinciding with the Maccabi fans' arrival, pro-Palestinian activists assembled in Dam Square in protest of Israel's ethnic cleansing of Palestinians in Gaza.

Groups of Maccabi fans reportedly went through the city, confronting the pro-Palestine protesters and generally causing trouble. Videos show Maccabi fans tearing down Palestine flags from the windows of private residences. In one such video, you can hear people serenading the flag-ripper with "Fuck you, Palestine." Per the NYT, Amsterdam police say some Israeli fans burned one Palestine flag and also vandalized a taxi. One Twitter account posted a video that purportedly shows a Maccabi fan smashing a taxi with a chain.

Tensions remained high going into Thursday, the day of the match. Maccabi fans again took to the streets, at times chanting racist phrases like "Death to the Arabs." One chant heard on video goes "Let the IDF win, we will fuck the Arabs." Lyrics of that same Maccabi song include "Why is school out in Gaza? There are no children left there." A photographer spotted one Maccabi fan unfurling a Make America Great Again flag. These scenes led to further clashes with pro-Palestine protesters. Several videos going around social media show violence between locals and Maccabi fans. The following, widely shared video can be found in many news articles, often positioned as evidence of Dutch violence on Israelis—a CNN World video explicitly presents the video as "Israeli football fans [being] beaten and injured"—even though the photographer who took the video has clarified that it depicts Maccabi fans attacking a Dutch man

In response to Wednesday's events, Amsterdam police were out in full force on Thursday, though their presence didn't prevent all of the violence. After the match itself, a 5-0 Ajax victory, during which Maccabi fans disrupted a moment of silence for victims of the recent floods in Valencia, Spain—the Spanish government has made efforts to distance itself from Israel in light of the attacks on Gaza—Dutch authorities escorted Maccabi fans onto a fleet of buses that took them from the stadium to their hotels. However, some Maccabi fans who lingered around the city found themselves set upon by groups of Dutchmen, who, as Amsterdam city council member Jazie Veldhuyzen put it in an interview with Al Jazeera English, "mobilized themselves" and "countered the attacks that started on Wednesday." On social media, there are videos that purportedly show these "scooter youth" fighting Maccabi fans.
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The Media Can't Figure Out Why Some Racist Israeli Soccer Hooligans Were Beaten Up (Original Post) WhiskeyGrinder Nov 9 OP
You left out the cheap shot at President Biden. Mosby Nov 9 #1
I figured some folks would focus on that instead of what actually happened in Amsterdam, so excerpted just the salient WhiskeyGrinder Nov 9 #2
What does focusing on what actually happened have to do with this story? Beastly Boy Nov 9 #8
There is this. Eko Nov 9 #3
Yeah, I can clearly see the half dozen or so hardened hooligans in this picture Beastly Boy Nov 9 #6
Yeah I didn't say that. I specifically didn't say that. I specifically said this wasn't evidence for the rest at all. Eko Nov 9 #9
Let me rethink that... Beastly Boy Nov 10 #16
Thx Mosby Hekate Nov 11 #80
I can't figure out how some 60 masked peaceful pro-Palestinian protesters were arrested for Beastly Boy Nov 9 #4
It's pretty obvious to me JustAnotherGen Nov 9 #5
Maybe some context from this Jewish Israeli politician in the Knesset will help vanessa_ca Nov 10 #28
Good on the Knesset member who represents 6% of Israelis on the extreme left of the political spectrum. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #32
Hadash hold 5 seats Israeli Nov 11 #52
I see it more as Israel's democrats losing our country. Beastly Boy Nov 11 #55
And the Israeli media? As usual: approaches, hides, and distorts reality in the service of the authorities. Israeli Nov 11 #50
Easy there, zimmy. Iggo Nov 11 #78
"Death to the Arabs". AloeVera Nov 9 #7
You know Israel likes dump right? Eko Nov 9 #10
Only 17% of Israelis supported Harris for Pres??! AloeVera Nov 9 #12
Nah, we have to keep supporting them on their Eko Nov 9 #14
Are you American ??? Israeli Nov 11 #51
Yup, I am an American. Eko Nov 11 #73
Welcome to my world Israeli Nov 13 #82
Ha thanks. Eko Nov 13 #83
Why would Democrats get upset with what what non-voting Israelis 5000 miles away think, rather than Beastly Boy Nov 10 #19
I have news for you... choie Nov 10 #26
What a coincidence! Beastly Boy Nov 10 #27
That's 22% fucking stupid asses choie Nov 10 #36
Not to disagree with you, but how does this relate to Beastly Boy Nov 10 #38
50% of Catholics, 60% of Protestants voted for that criminal. Mosby Nov 10 #46
So do American Muslims. Beastly Boy Nov 9 #13
So that makes which one good? Eko Nov 9 #15
you tell me. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #17
Did I not ask you? Eko Nov 10 #20
Watch me ignore your endless bickering: Beastly Boy Nov 10 #22
Watch all of us see you not answering a easy question. Eko Nov 10 #25
American muslims showed themselves as single issue voters. Mosby Nov 10 #47
I think their answer will be obvious choie Nov 10 #37
That could be totally right, Eko Nov 10 #18
No, silly, the conversation is about the antisemitic attack by supporters of Palestine against supporters of a friggin Beastly Boy Nov 10 #21
I mean, dump sign? Israels supprt for dump? Eko Nov 10 #24
I will take a wild guess and say Beastly Boy Nov 9 #11
Great post malaise Nov 10 #31
Assaulting an Arab cab driver, tearing down Palestinian flags, racist chants, vandalism... Rob H. Nov 10 #23
...as 60 alleged assilants of a cab driver ended up in a hospital with serious injuries, including knife wounds. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #34
63 people were arrested, about 30 suffered light injuries, and five were treated Rob H. Nov 10 #39
Dutch authorities, including King Wilhelm-Alexander, described the attacks as antisemitic. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #41
10 Israelis were injured, according to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs. AloeVera Nov 10 #48
If they were locals, they were all Maccabi Tel Aviv supporters. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #49
It's surprising more locals weren't injured Rob H. Nov 11 #56
Everyone should watch this video. AloeVera Nov 11 #68
Let me explain some of this from a Euro Football culture point of view Prairie Gates Nov 10 #29
THIS malaise Nov 10 #45
Good report malaise Nov 10 #30
Sky News reported on it, accurately at first Rob H. Nov 10 #33
... and then, for no reason, changed their minds and decided to report outright lies... Beastly Boy Nov 10 #35
This person actually lives in the Netherlands Rob H. Nov 10 #40
So do the Mayor of Amsterdam and the King of Netherlands, I suspect. Beastly Boy Nov 10 #43
That's shocking. I used to think Sky News was a trustworthy source. Mr. Sparkle Nov 11 #53
FAFO racist assholes. ZonkerHarris Nov 10 #42
This just in: Violent hominids behave according to their nature misanthrope Nov 10 #44
Good report here malaise Nov 11 #54
all sources deny that the Jewish supporters misbehaved or brought aggression upon themselves" Mosby Nov 11 #57
De Telegraaf is a right-wing tabloid Rob H. Nov 11 #60
So what? Mosby Nov 11 #63
Right-wing sources aren't permitted here Rob H. Nov 11 #70
That's not accurate Mosby Nov 11 #72
Calling out racism and bigotry, sure Rob H. Nov 11 #81
Hamas supporters attacked Jews leaving Noa Kirel's concert in New York City last night. Mosby Nov 11 #58
Trumps steal has emboldened racists peregrinus Nov 11 #74
Yes, and just because it's starting with Jews Mosby Nov 11 #75
Is this kid a racist? Are all Jews legitimate targets? Mosby Nov 11 #59
The "Jew Hunt" was planned days before. Mosby Nov 11 #61
The "Jew Hunt" is starting in Begium Mosby Nov 11 #62
Amazon employee Alfaisal Al Khaledi shockingly defends the antisemitic pogroms Mosby Nov 11 #64
Richie Torres on the Pogrom Mosby Nov 11 #65
AIPAC is his biggest donor Rob H. Nov 11 #71
The antisemitic mob also beat up women Mosby Nov 11 #66
New info Mosby Nov 11 #67
This message was self-deleted by its author Mosby Nov 11 #69
Riots have broken out again in Amsterdam tonight Mosby Nov 11 #76
Amsterdam Mayor Femke Halsema.... Mosby Nov 11 #77
The horrifying videos just keep coming out of Amsterdam Mosby Nov 11 #79

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
1. You left out the cheap shot at President Biden.
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 09:41 PM
Nov 9
Stripped of context, visiting soccer fans getting drunk and causing havoc ahead of a big continental match in Europe would be so routine as to be almost unworthy of mention. But the hooligans in this instance were supporters of the Israeli soccer club Maccabi Tel Aviv, and the residents of Amsterdam weren't keen to their disruptive behavior, which meant that outlets like the New York Times and politicians like Joe Biden trained their focus on what happened and characterized it with their warped clarity.


I get the sense that this website (defector.com) doesn't support democrats.

WhiskeyGrinder

(23,830 posts)
2. I figured some folks would focus on that instead of what actually happened in Amsterdam, so excerpted just the salient
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 09:44 PM
Nov 9

parts that delivered on the headline.

Eko

(8,489 posts)
3. There is this.
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 09:55 PM
Nov 9
https://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/fan-opens-a-trump-banner-as-fans-of-maccabi-tel-aviv-stage-news-photo/2182889610?adppopup=true
Those seem to be Maccabi fans. It's definitely not a slam dunk or anything as far as evidence for the rest but it seems like it may make you rethink what is going on here a bit and be a little open to what may have happened. At least that is what I think.
eko.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
6. Yeah, I can clearly see the half dozen or so hardened hooligans in this picture
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:06 PM
Nov 9

use a Trump flag to harass about 60 peaceful pro-Palestine protesters without any Palestine flags on the streets of Amsterdam.

Because nothing says street fight like people standing around and looking bored as they descend down the half-empty escalator. Sure makes me rethink what is going on, not to mention what may or may not have happened here.

Eko

(8,489 posts)
9. Yeah I didn't say that. I specifically didn't say that. I specifically said this wasn't evidence for the rest at all.
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:18 PM
Nov 9

Just that hey, here is a pic of supporters of that soccer team holding dump signs so maybe we should be cautious of coming to conclusions at this point but somehow you just missed that point. Its almost like you are in a bubble of defending any Israeli no matter what they do. Talking about that, can you say that the Israeli citizens that attacked food trucks going into gaza were wrong? Obviously you can. Its not like the Israelis overwhelming support dump https://www.timesofisrael.com/poll-shows-israelis-massively-favor-trump-over-harris-in-us-election/. over Harris. Interesting stuff you know.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
16. Let me rethink that...
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:18 AM
Nov 10

Ummm... I never said you said that.

I only said that the silly picture you posted did not make me rethink what is going on there a bit, or at all, or be a little open to what may have happened. Because the picture you posted does not reflect a single bit of what may or may not have happened, regardless of what you think.

You may think that maybe you should be cautious over a silly photo, but I think "we" should be far more cautious over a violent antisemitic attack depicted on many pictures taken at the scene of the crime.

It is just that I prefer to remain in the bubble of factual evidence rather than breaking free of this bubble on the basis of ridiculous innuendo.

Note that I am totally ignoring your transparent attempt to deflect from the subject at hand.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
4. I can't figure out how some 60 masked peaceful pro-Palestinian protesters were arrested for
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 10:36 PM
Nov 9

beating the shit out of the racist Israeli soccer hooligans, and how only the aforementioned hooligans ended up in a hospital.

Makes me wonder who exactly the violent racist hooligans are in this story and who is trying to get away with shameless spin.

JustAnotherGen

(33,540 posts)
5. It's pretty obvious to me
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 10:51 PM
Nov 9

And it was pretty well planned. Can I use the P word or will it get twisted around back on the Jewish Crime victims? Because that looked like a Pogrom to me.

vanessa_ca

(15 posts)
28. Maybe some context from this Jewish Israeli politician in the Knesset will help
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 08:34 AM
Nov 10



Ofer Cassif עופר כסיף عوفر كسيف
@ofercass
רוח הפשיזם הישראלי הגיעה לאמסטרדם: אוהדים משתוללים באלימות, מכים, תולשים דגלים פלסטינים ברחובות משל היו כוח כובש וצורחים סיסמאות נאציות בעד השמדת עם, ומתבכיינים כשהמצב מדרדר לכאוס מוחלט ואלימות החוזרת אליהם כבומרנג.

כל אלימות הינה מגונה ובלתי מתקבלת על הדעת. שני הצדדים צריכים לתת את הדין על החוליגניזם שלהם.

והתקשורת הישראלית? כהרגלה: מתקרבנת, מסתירה, ומסלפת את המציאות בשירות השלטונות.

Translation - "The spirit of Israeli fascism has reached Amsterdam: fans go on a violent rampage, beating, tearing up Palestinian flags in the streets as if they were an occupying force and shouting Nazi slogans in favor of the extermination of a nation, and whining when the situation degenerates into complete chaos and violence returns to them like a boomerang.

Any violence is obscene and unacceptable. Both sides should be held accountable for their hooliganism.

And the Israeli media? As usual: approaches, hides, and distorts reality in the service of the authorities."

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
32. Good on the Knesset member who represents 6% of Israelis on the extreme left of the political spectrum.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 09:07 AM
Nov 10

While I don't dismiss the fascist streak in the Trump-supporting Israeli right wingers, and with all due respect to Mr Cassif, there was no shortage of fascists in Amsterdam, as the events in question show, before a single Israeli soccer fan arrived there.

It just so turns out that some fascists are more violent, more bigoted, more numerous and more organized, and more of an imminent and permanent threat than others. And even Mr Cassif must realize, despite his awkward display of both-sideism on social media, that the law makes a distinction between speech and physical violence.

The content and the context of his tweet do not change the facts of the crimes one bit.

Israeli

(4,293 posts)
52. Hadash hold 5 seats
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 06:53 AM
Nov 11

in the Knesset right now .....thats one less than Otzma Yehudit .

Who holds all the power and why ??

We that bravely call ourselves The Democrats (Israel) hold only 4.

the Trump-supporting Israeli right wingers
..............have taken over my country
and yours .

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
55. I see it more as Israel's democrats losing our country.
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 07:59 AM
Nov 11

There used to be a time, if I recall correctly, when the Labor Party held the majority of Knesset seats and was the only party in history able to form a government without forming coalitions.

This changed when Israel's politics went global, and this might explain why the right wingers took over and how. The right wingers in Israel get enormous support, and not just financial, mostly from the right wing religious zealots, Jewish and Christian, in the US, Europe and elsewhere.

Conversely, Israel's left not only gets no support globally, but the traditional antisemitic elements in the West and the newly formed antisemitic elements in the Global South not only ignore Israel's left, but make no distinction between the left and the right, or the religious and the secular segments of Israeli society, and actively demonize both with equally extreme prejudice. Since these activities come largely from the supposedly enlightened Western progressives, the popular resentments within Israel increasingly, and naturally, trend against Israel's secular democrats who are seen as the allies of those who openly despise and undermine Israel as a whole.

The Israeli right wingers could not have taken over Israel without the active assistance, in equal measure, from both the global right wingers and the global left wingers outside Israel.

Edited to add: to me as a Jew, political and ideological affiliation is very important, and my presence on this site makes clear of what it is, but it is secondary to resisting antisemitism in all its forms. The history of my people taught me this lesson.

Israeli

(4,293 posts)
50. And the Israeli media? As usual: approaches, hides, and distorts reality in the service of the authorities.
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 05:44 AM
Nov 11
Israeli and Foreign Media Outlets Revise Coverage of Amsterdam Attacks on Israeli Soccer Fans

The U.K.'s Sky News and Israel's Channel 12 removed references to anti-Arab behavior after facing criticism over their coverage of soccer match violence

(snip)

Meanwhile, Israeli news outlet Channel 12 deleted its post about Maccabi Tel Aviv fans tearing down a Palestinian flag after the network faced backlash, including from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's son, Yair......

On Friday, the outlet posted a report on X by correspondent Keren Betzalel, who said on air, "There are claims that these street altercations between Maccabi Tel Aviv fans and Muslim groups began on Wednesday night, when, according to reports from Amsterdam, Maccabi Tel Aviv fans walking the streets saw Palestinian flags hanging on various buildings or residences, tore them down and got into loud altercations with Muslim taxi drivers."

Yair Netanyahu posted Channel 12's report on his Telegram channel, commenting, "Whose side is Channel 12 on?"....

(snip)

After activist Ariel Bernstein was heavily criticized for a post in which he said that Israeli fans were "walking around central Amsterdam, cursing, threatening, bullying, and adding a lot of unnecessary fuel to an already tense situation between communities," he issued a clarification.

"I would like to explain what I meant, for anyone who cares," Bernstein wrote on X. "There is absolutely no justification for organized violence against fans in any form. Violence against innocent people is wrong.
"At the same time," he added, "the bullying behavior of Maccabi fans beforehand is also part of the story. There's no denying it. My main criticism is directed at the Israeli media, which isn't telling the whole story."


Source : haaretz

Link : https://archive.md/7ZgKt

AloeVera

(1,941 posts)
7. "Death to the Arabs".
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:11 PM
Nov 9

Did any Western leader condemn that racist, hateful chant?

"Let IDF win, we will f*** the Arabs. Ole, ole, ole. In Gaza there’s no schooling, there’s no children left there.”

In Israel, this is a popular football chant. Shouted with glee and joy.

All very normal and cool. Absolutely.

Bring that chant to Europe, however, and Israelis will see a different reaction.

But it's all just anti-Semitism, right?

AloeVera

(1,941 posts)
12. Only 17% of Israelis supported Harris for Pres??!
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:36 PM
Nov 9

Vs 66% for Trump.

Among Likud supporters, it's 93-1 in favour of Trump. A cult.

Better call all Democrats, they will be very upset about this.

Or we could all just switch sides, to maintain our perfect score of always siding with Israel. Yeah, that's the ticket.


Eko

(8,489 posts)
14. Nah, we have to keep supporting them on their
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:54 PM
Nov 9

WAR OF TERROR
As Borat once said.
I mean fuck hamas, but really? Israelis support dump. Their govt supports dump. At this point cant we say that hey, you are really not our friends and are acting in a very uh, non-american way so we wont support you also? hamas very bad, you not good also?

Eko

(8,489 posts)
73. Yup, I am an American.
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 03:50 PM
Nov 11

And,,,,, I wont support dump, his administration and his actions unlike the majority of Israel.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
19. Why would Democrats get upset with what what non-voting Israelis 5000 miles away think, rather than
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:32 AM
Nov 10

being upset with what voting Arab Americans think?

And why are you so upset over the former and not the latter?

choie

(4,478 posts)
26. I have news for you...
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 01:39 AM
Nov 10

I'm Jewish and lived on Long Island and still have ties there. Do you know how many Jewish people voted for trump because they think Biden and Harris are antisemites and anti-Israel? Lots. Fucking stupid asses.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
27. What a coincidence!
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 07:48 AM
Nov 10

I am also Jewish and still live on Long Island. And, since we are counting fucking stupid asses, I know exactly how many Jewish people voted for Trump: 22%. 78% of Jewish American voters voted for Harris. I believe this is the highest ratio of Harris voters among America's ethnic minorities.

Compare this to fewer than 50% of Muslim Americans voting for Harris.

This is not news to me, but it may be to you.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
38. Not to disagree with you, but how does this relate to
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 11:54 AM
Nov 10

what non-voting Israelis 5000 miles away think of Trump and the American Muslims actually voting for Trump?

Especially when we seem to agree that 22% of American Jews and, by analogy, over 50% of America's Muslims are fucking stupid asses.

Eko

(8,489 posts)
20. Did I not ask you?
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:38 AM
Nov 10

It was a direct question to you, are you incapable of answering it? Its a simple thing, there was even a ? involved. That should have let you know that you should answer but instead you deflected like Ted Cruz on an storm day.

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
47. American muslims showed themselves as single issue voters.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 06:44 PM
Nov 10

The Jewish American vote is the same as always, but the Arab and Muslim vote changed because of foreign policy issues. That seems short sighted on the part of those communities.

Eko

(8,489 posts)
18. That could be totally right,
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:26 AM
Nov 10

And if it wasn't I would be upset if it were not so but the numbers coming out now are inconclusive. Of course the conversation is not about American jews or even about American Muslims but about the members of the Jewish nation and who they support. Dump is who they support by a wide margin and you want to keep defending them for whatever reason. Why you want to keep supporting a dump supporting nation is beyond me. They are a dump supporting nation, You cant argue against that. That should make you at least cautious about the whole situation but here you are pushing forward with your support. Wholeheartedly behind a nation that supports dump. 2 countries can be wrong you know.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
21. No, silly, the conversation is about the antisemitic attack by supporters of Palestine against supporters of a friggin
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:39 AM
Nov 10

Israeli soccer team in Amsterdam!

But for some reason you keep deflecting from what the conversation is about.

It's way past my bed time. I don't want to get in trouble, so I am giong to have to respond to your deflections with wishing you sweet dreams.

Good night.

Eko

(8,489 posts)
24. I mean, dump sign? Israels supprt for dump?
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:45 AM
Nov 10

You just going to let all that slide away like it didn't happen? Not even address that?

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
11. I will take a wild guess and say
Sat Nov 9, 2024, 11:31 PM
Nov 9

that there were as many Western leader condemning that racist, hateful chant as there were Western leaders condemning chants like "now you know how it feels like" shouted with glee and joy as the violent mobs were beating the shit out of people lying on the ground.

Now that's a different reaction, allright! And you seem to relish the thought of it.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
23. Assaulting an Arab cab driver, tearing down Palestinian flags, racist chants, vandalism...
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 12:42 AM
Nov 10

It’s a mystery for the ages.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
34. ...as 60 alleged assilants of a cab driver ended up in a hospital with serious injuries, including knife wounds.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 10:51 AM
Nov 10

Must have been self-inflicted in the course of tearing down Palestinian flags and racist chants.

Or else, that assailed cab driver has some mad knife handling skills and is wasting his talents on driving a cab.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
39. 63 people were arrested, about 30 suffered light injuries, and five were treated
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 01:30 PM
Nov 10

for their injuries at a hospital; they’ve since been released. Forty people were fined for public disturbance, 10 were cited for vandalism, and the four people remaining in custody atm will be tried for public violence. The news articles I found didn’t break those numbers down further in terms of country of residence.

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
41. Dutch authorities, including King Wilhelm-Alexander, described the attacks as antisemitic.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 04:05 PM
Nov 10

According to information provided to Dutch law enforcement and an investigation by a Dutch newspaper, the attack was coordinated via the Telegram social media platform as a "Jew Hunt". A video circulating on social media shows a man screaming "I am not Jewish" in response to being repeatedly kicked. The Mayor of Amsterdam stated in a press conference that the assailants actively sought out Israeli fans.

But what to they know?




AloeVera

(1,941 posts)
48. 10 Israelis were injured, according to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 07:32 PM
Nov 10

The other 20 injured were locals.

Interesting.



Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
49. If they were locals, they were all Maccabi Tel Aviv supporters.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 10:08 PM
Nov 10
At least 10 Israelis were injured, according to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

By "local" accounts, on the other hand,
Five people had to be taken to hospital as a result of the violence. They were all discharged on Friday. As far as is known, 20 to 30 other Maccabi Tel Aviv supporters were lightly injured.
https://www.brusselstimes.com/belgium/1304602/anti-israeli-agression-in-amsterdam-10-still-detained-mayor-ashamed-of-violence-beyond-all-limits-tbtb

As far as it was known on Friday, 8 November 2024.

No reports of other "locals" being injured, just as there are no reports of any Israelis being arrested. Unless you count one documented instance in which a guy was screaming "I am not Jewish" as the other "locals" were beating the shit out of him.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
56. It's surprising more locals weren't injured
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 11:47 AM
Nov 11

The hooligans are on video picking up rocks, sticks, and pipes as they made their way into the city center following the match.

This Amsterdammer teen journalist actually does a really good job of covering things in real-time; you might have to turn on English subtitles, though:

?

AloeVera

(1,941 posts)
68. Everyone should watch this video.
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 12:42 PM
Nov 11

I saw it yesterday, glad you posted it.

This kid is amazing. As he says, he was the only "media" there, where the Maccabi hooligans were stealing metal pipes, wood boards and throwing them at cop cars and people, donning masks (!) and rioting in the streets.

The cops didn't do much, not much presence, though a couple of cars followed them. Not sure if that was before or after the thugs threw the metal rods at them.

Eventually the police surrounded about 100 of the Maccabi fans but it's not clear if any arrests were made.

There is also the Dutch journalist whose video of Maccabi fans rioting was falsely used by Western media as an example of local pro-Palestinians rioting!

So reality gets turned on its head again by the Western MSM when it doesn't fit the Israeli narrative of "good vs evil" and victimhood.

But this kid puts CNN, BBC and all the other pro-Israeli international media to shame. He does real journalism while they are stenographers and propagandists for the narrative they prefer and work "hard" to maintain.

Prairie Gates

(3,042 posts)
29. Let me explain some of this from a Euro Football culture point of view
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 08:37 AM
Nov 10

A few points:

1. Maccabi Tel Aviv has perhaps the most disgusting racist ultras in European competition - Anyone who disputes this doesn't really understand ultra culture and shouldn't be taken seriously. Having the most racist ultras in Euro competition is also a very high bar, because you're going up against Lazio, AZ Alkmaar, and pretty much any team's ultras based in the former Yugoslavia. Hell, Ajax gets honorable mention in that table. Maccabi Tel Aviv are up there with the absolute worst. They are notorious for it.

2. Ultras have to be distinguished from ordinary "fans" (we call them supporters). Ultras (or what some would call "hooligans" ) are very nearly organized paramilitaries at this point. Ordinary fans wear kits and scarves and are usually relatively clueless about the ultra conflicts in the offing.

When I first heard this story, I thought it was about fights between Ajax ultras and Maccabi Tel Avi ultras, primarily because both groups are up for it and both are extremely violent. It was notable that several Israeli officials insisted that this wasn't a story about what they called "supporter culture," a euphemism for ultra crime and fighting. I wasn't so sure.

It seems like what happened here is hard to explain unless groups 1 and 2 are distinguished and given their own stories. I have no doubt that the Maccabi Tel Aviv ultras were acting like racist asshats in Amsterdam. I also think that both Tel Aviv ultras AND ordinary fans were drawn into the fight. The attacks of group 1 do not, of course, justify the attacks on group 2. It's kind of a metaphor in that way, no? Anyway, this is where a correct and reasonable discussion of what happened can start.

malaise

(278,051 posts)
30. Good report
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 08:39 AM
Nov 10

Don’t blame them for thinking they are above the law.
War crimes and genocide continue with Western complicity.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
33. Sky News reported on it, accurately at first
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 09:58 AM
Nov 10

…then completely turned the story around to imply that the hooligans who started everything were actually the victims.

?si=_JmMlJTkEc1PMPVb

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
35. ... and then, for no reason, changed their minds and decided to report outright lies...
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 10:59 AM
Nov 10

when they found out that the hooligans were actually the victims.

Shame on them. What kind of journalists are they when they can't go on with false reporting after it is proven to be false?

No integrity, dammit.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
40. This person actually lives in the Netherlands
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 01:51 PM
Nov 10

The media is making the Maccabi hooligans out to be the victims when they are anything but.

?si=wjmAdxyaN5edrHDp

Beastly Boy

(11,136 posts)
43. So do the Mayor of Amsterdam and the King of Netherlands, I suspect.
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 04:10 PM
Nov 10

They too are making the Maccabi hooligans out to be the victims.

And so do the Amsterdam law enforcement authorities.

But what do they know?

misanthrope

(8,223 posts)
44. This just in: Violent hominids behave according to their nature
Sun Nov 10, 2024, 04:13 PM
Nov 10

Tribalism holds sway in face of thousands of years of evidence.

malaise

(278,051 posts)
54. Good report here
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 07:15 AM
Nov 11
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/10/amsterdam-police-charge-four-after-attack-on-israeli-football-fans

Amsterdam’s police chief, Peter Holla, said there had been “incidents on both sides”, starting on Wednesday night when Maccabi fans tore down a Palestinian flag from the facade of a building in the city centre, shouted “fuck you Palestine” and destroyed a taxi.

The Dutch public prosecution has confirmed that 62 people were arrested on Thursday. These arrests were made before and during the Ajax game, which began at 8pm local time. Geert Wilders, the head of the far-right Party for Freedom, whose party is part of the Dutch government coalition, said he was “speechless” that no arrests appeared to have been made after the match.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
60. De Telegraaf is a right-wing tabloid
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 12:10 PM
Nov 11

known to have collaborated with the Nazis in WWII, so take from that what you will.

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
63. So what?
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 12:15 PM
Nov 11

People post here from all sorts of publications, including communist and marxist outlets.

If the discussion board wants to better define sourcing I will be all in on that.

Can't wait.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
70. Right-wing sources aren't permitted here
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 01:35 PM
Nov 11

Generally Marxists and Communists are on the left in the US.

ETA: The Communist Party USA is to the left of the Democratic Party.

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
72. That's not accurate
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 02:21 PM
Nov 11

Any source is allowed if the content is consistent with the "values of DU".

The X post in question is exposing bigotry and racism, I think that's consistent with Democratic values. YMMV.

Rob H.

(5,568 posts)
81. Calling out racism and bigotry, sure
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 06:58 PM
Nov 11

Trying to memory hole events where people are on video chanting racist slogans, singing racist songs, and committing acts of vandalism about and against Arabs, no.

YMMV.

peregrinus

(193 posts)
74. Trumps steal has emboldened racists
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 03:58 PM
Nov 11

and yes im calling it a steal. But the racists on both sides have their free reign to be out in the open. Free pass stamped by Trump

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
67. New info
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 12:24 PM
Nov 11

New testimony from the horrifying pogrom in Amsterdam the other night.

Yaheli, a 14-year-old Jewish boy, along with his grandfather, ran in fear for their lives as they were chased down in Amsterdam after the soccer game.

While fleeing, they picked up a couple of sticks from the ground for self-defense.

Suddenly, two Dutch police cars arrived and stopped nearby. The officers immediately became aggressive without allowing them to explain that they were holding the sticks for self-defense.

The Dutch police ordered them to lie on the ground, then started kicking them, including the 14-year-old boy.

Afterwards, they were put into a police car to be driven to their hotel, where they noticed "Free Palestine" stickers inside the vehicle.

The Dutch police knew they were Jewish, which is why they were aggressive, attacked them, and kicked them on the ground.

They were aware of what had been going on all along.


Response to WhiskeyGrinder (Original post)

Mosby

(17,453 posts)
77. Amsterdam Mayor Femke Halsema....
Mon Nov 11, 2024, 05:41 PM
Nov 11
Amsterdam Mayor Femke Halsema announces she will hold an emergency meeting tomorrow with representatives from the city’s mosques in an attempt to stop the pogroms and riots in the city.



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