COVID vaccine only 64% effective against Delta variant - Israeli research

[OhioChick]

Coronavirus cabinet to consider new restrictions on Tuesday * Ministry says no booster shot for the general public yet.

By MAAYAN JAFFE-HOFFMAN, ROSSELLA TERCATIN JULY 5, 2021 22:49

In the past month, the coronavirus vaccine has proven to be 64% effective against symptomatic infection by the Delta variant, the Health Ministry reported Monday. It then gave the green light for a booster shot for immunocompromised patients, as the coronavirus cabinet prepares to meet today to discuss new measures to fight against the new outbreak.

Although the ministry also reported that the inoculation’s ability to prevent serious morbidity has remained very high, currently standing at 93%, the cabinet is expected to discuss the possibility of additional restrictions on the public.

Among others, the authorities will examine an outline to bring back a version of the“green pass” for venues and gatherings mostly attended by unvaccinated or vulnerable audiences – like children or the elderly. Until a few weeks ago, the green pass system limited access to certain activities only to vaccinated and recovered individuals, or to children not eligible for a jab with a negative PCR test.

The move was recommended in a meeting of the Advisory Committee for Corona Vaccines Sunday night.

More: https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/health-officials-rule-covid-booster-recommended-for-immunocompromised-672894

[SheltieLover]

1. Yup!

Sad, but apparently true!

And, while hospitalization & death protection is high, even asymptomatic and mild cases can & do result in long-haul.

Be safe all! 😷

Ty for posting!

[OhioChick]

3. Interestingly enough...

Israel is 60% 2-dose Pfizer fully vaccinated. No other country has vaccinations higher than Israel.

Link to tweet

[SheltieLover]

8. Yes they have the highest vax rate

Scary stuff!

[uponit7771]

28. Same article says 93% effective against hospitalizations and death so doing it's MAIN job

[herding cats]

2. Whelp. We all gonna die.

Mother Earth is rocking this pandemic to rid herself of all we fleas. Humans won't social distance forever, it goes against our nature. If folks don't vaccinate and take this seriously, thus curbing variants, we in stupid nations can expect to eventually be marginalized from civilized society.

[OhioChick]

4. Yes, we sure are....

Especially many of the immunocompromised, as well as children under age 12 years that can't even get vaccinated, yet.

[herding cats]

6. I'm immunocompromised.

I've had two Moderna vaccines and a J&J. I'll be tested Thursday to see my immune response.

I get it, but there's only so much we responsible people can do. Human nature (you saw the UK's announcement today?) isn't going to change.

[vercetti2021]

5. I thought Moderna was 90% against Delta?

I've been going maskless for a few weeks now

[OhioChick]

9. Better get out the masks again n/t

[vercetti2021]

12. I guess so

Damn it. I was getting use to normal since I was protected. But I guess not as high as I thought.

[joetheman]

16. I feel normal WITH my mask. nt

[Scrivener7]

20. You are MUCH MUCH safer, and thank God for that. But you are still able to catch it

and in numbers much higher than we originally thought. You likely won't die, though you could, and you likely won't get really sick, though you could. But even mild cases are being found to have bad long term effects.

So just protect yourself, because I like your late night snack musing.

[Sherman A1]

17. Never put the masks

Away, still wearing them in public indoor settings.

[OhioChick]

66. That's wise..... n/t

[Scrivener7]

19. Israel has Pfizer and that number is not holding up as Delta takes hold. Moderna

uses similar technology to Pfizer, so it is likely the same will be found when Delta gets here and all us Moderna people are counted.

We just need to put the mask on. It isn't a big deal.

[uponit7771]

26. 93% effective against hospitalizations and death means it's doing it's MAIN job

[Scrivener7]

27. It also means you still need to mask and take precautions because even some mild

cases are being found to have bad long term effects, and more vaccinated people are getting the Delta variant.

[uponit7771]

29. What percentage of mild cases? tia

[Scrivener7]

30. Google is your friend.

[uponit7771]

33. There aren't any studies of mild cases of vaxed people yet

[Scrivener7]

35. .

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/23/health/long-covid-symptoms.html

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210412/the-most-common-lingering-symptoms-after-mild-covid

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2021/04/14/long-term-symptoms

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/long-term-impact-of-mild-covid-19_uk_5f0710f0c5b6480493cc5658

https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/prevention-cures/506752-mild-cases-of-coronavirus-may-not-be-as-mild-as

https://www.self.com/story/post-covid-problems-fair-health-study

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2021/04/210407174321.htm

There are many more, if you care to look.

If you really need to weasel out of it by insisting on saying "oh, but those people aren't vaxxed" have at it.

I don't really care if you take precautions or not after you are vaxxed. I am not sure why you are insisting that the vaccine was not meant to prevent disease only hospitalization and death. Of course it was meant to prevent disease, and it is doing that to a large extent. Which is great.

But you also seem to be insisting that there is no reason for concern once one is vaccinated. That is not responsible.

[uponit7771]

36. None in those links have peer reviewed controlled studies of the vaxed

[Scrivener7]

37. See my update to the post. What is your point here? You seem to be very adamant that no one

should be taking precautions after they are vaccinated. Is that your point?

[uponit7771]

39. Vaxes weren't meant to be inoculation and the mild vaxed cases don't have any ...

... data behind them suggesting a long hauler effect like the unvaxed.

The vaxes are working historically well at what they were originally billed for; preventing hospitalizations and death

[Scrivener7]

40. So what is your point? What is the reason you keep saying over and over that the vaccines

are not meant to prevent disease, and also insisting that mild cases are not a problem?

Is your point that you think people should not take precautions after they are vaccinated? That's what it seems like your point is.

If it is not your point, what IS your point?

[Ms. Toad]

62. That's a claim that just won't die

Of course it was meant to prevent disease, and it is doing that to a large extent.

Just like masks aren't effective, they are only effective for the non-wearer, Oh, wait, they are effective for everyone and - now - don't you dare both wear a mask and be vaccinated. Way too many messaging screw-ups!

I can't imagine anyone, with a straight face suggesting that we only meant to lessen the symptoms of {polio, measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc}, not prevent infection.

And, suddenly, after decades of success in producing vaccines which prevent infection we suddenly decided to go for less on this one?

Makes zero sense at all.

(I get that those in power contributed to it by focusing on serious illness and death - as a means to shorten the data gathering process and get quick emergency approval. But to suggest that wa all that was ever intended? Give me a break!)

[Scrivener7]

63. Seems nutty to me. Especially because it DOES prevent disease.

[Ms. Toad]

64. They weren't sure at the beginning -

since they didn't even test regularly - only when symptoms presented. I suspect the may not have had a reliable enough supply of tests to properly determine prevention v. symptom control.

Subsequent trials, with a bit more luxury of time - and ample supply of testing material, tested every participant (in both the placebo and the vaccine group) and demonstrated that it acts just like every other vaccine.

[Calculating]

54. No, masks never again

I wear glasses and hate wearing masks in addition to them. I'm vaccinated and in good health, I'll take my chances from here. If I get a mild case so be it, it will just leave me with a better immunity. This is never going away, and we can all hide from it forever or take our chances.

[Scrivener7]

57. You go with your bad self. But, seriously, wearing a mask is "hiding from it forever?"

The drama!

[Happy Hoosier]

31. I HATE masks... especially in the Summer.

My glasses fog up and my beard sweats. Yuck. I‘ll wear them if I habe to, but I will never normalize them.

[Scrivener7]

32. Meh. I've had hangnails that gave me worse problems.

[Happy Hoosier]

56. That's not really the point.

I mean, I WILL wear them if the risk calls for it, or if the venue requests it.

But otherwise, it's not something I will choose to do.

I respect those who choose otherwise.

[Hortensis]

65. It's also about not spreading the virus. I've felt good knowing

it can't pass through me. Not so much with these new variants, so we've returned to double masking. After all, if you're going to wear one anyway, a second's nothing.

[uponit7771]

25. Preventing hospitalizations and death. Never meant to be inoculation from get

[BannonsLiver]

46. This is a tiny non peer reviewed study. Wouldn't put much stock in it until it's peer reviewed.

And the over the top, totally lacking in perspective doomy posts at the top are some of the best unintentional comedy I’ve seen in years.

[Scrivener7]

52. Which over the top doomy posts are those? You keep referring to these in multiple threads, but

at the top of this thread, where you see some kind of funny crisis mongering, I see people discussing masking. That's neither over the top nor doomy.

If you mean the "we all gonna die" post, you know that was humor, right?

[chowder66]

55. More reason to stay masked while we wait for peer reviews. nt

[BannonsLiver]

58. People should practice caution no matter what

That said, I don’t get into the pants shitting that has become en Vogue with some here.

[chowder66]

59. Totally agree. : )

[ProfessorGAC]

61. +1

There seems a breathless need for "I told you so" with many of these posts.
And, this is the 2nd Israeli report that doesn't square with the numbers of other, larger countries.
Perhaps researchers should be looking into why that happened twice in a month.

[Mike Nelson]

7. Yikes!

... that's not what we've thought in the US. Every report I've seen says we are okay... 64% is not okay and the next variant will be worse!

[OhioChick]

11. Are you referring to the Lambda strain? n/t

[Mike Nelson]

14. No...

... I have not heard about it... but it's only logical that COVID will continue to adapt.

[OhioChick]

15. It's adapting....

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100215596179

[Pobeka]

34. Actually, the serum studies look really good for pfizer or moderna vs lambda

Pfizer and Moderna are performing better against lambda than they did against the S. African variant (B.1.351).

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100215596179#post16

[Scrivener7]

38. That's good news!

[Mike Nelson]

44. I thought...

... it would. Viruses want to live... that's why we should try to get more Trumpsters to get the vaccine. If they don't, COVID gets to circulate more... and adapt to human scientists' attempt to block the viruses.

[Scrivener7]

48. Also this is the reason why it is sensible for us to pay for vaccines for places that

can't afford them.

[crickets]

67. Absolutely. nt

[Duppers]

10. Thank you for posting this!

J & I have both shots of the Pfizer vaccine yet still mask up & use hand sanitizer. We've been stared at in public by who we assume were Republicans or stupid dems and I've actually been made fun of here. But know what, my sweet friend, f them!

[OhioChick]

13. I wish everyone were like the both of you in regard to precautions....

Take care, my friend.

[lagomorph777]

43. Same here, and EFF the maskholes and antivaxxers.

[wnylib]

49. There is one store where I shop that

still requires employees to wear masks. Their customers are about 50-50 on masks. Every place else, nobody wears masks, neither employees nor customers. I am short in height and a gray-haired senior. When I go into CVS, the employees smile as they speak condescendingly to me in my mask. I have been going there for many years and this condescension is new since the mask requirements were lifted. It's as if they are thinking, "Poor little old lady doesn't understand that the pandemic is over."

But I HAVE noticed that some young people in their teens and early 20s are wearing masks now, and at the grocery store, women with kids are putting masks on young ones under 12.

[RobertDevereaux]

18. Caution is always wise, and yet...

Josh Marshall from July 5:

The post below on the Delta variant has gotten a lot of attention. It’s always important to make a simple point: This isn’t “oh noooeesss, the vaccines don’t work anymore!” All the data suggests they remain extremely effective at preventing serious illness – over 90%. By the standards of almost any other vaccine they remain highly effective against any infection at all. Recent peer reviewed measures of the Pfizer vaccine against the Delta variant suggest efficacy in the high 80s percentage range. This new data out of Israel says it’s in the mid-60s. If you’re vaccinated, especially with one of the mRNA vaccines, there’s no reason for you to worry. The issue is more at the society-wide level, trying to make sense of the various data points suggesting a non-trivial level of reduced vaccine efficacy and how that maps onto how society at large will be operating in the coming months and years.

At the risk of stating the obvious, if you don’t want to die of COVID or end up in a hospital struggling to breath and fearing for your life, get vaccinated. You’ll be covered.

[Scrivener7]

21. The "over 90%" is from the manufacturer in controlled conditions. The Israel number is from

the virus out in the world.

The vaccine is a godsend. But it is not a cure or a solution.

He is wrong when he says there is no reason to worry. Israel is seeing a lot of cases among the fully vaccinated. His statement seems irresponsible to me.

Just wear the damn mask.

[uponit7771]

23. "..Recent peer reviewed measures .." That's not just manufacturer data and the vax's weren't meant .

... to be inoculation from get.

[Elessar Zappa]

22. True but that same study

says it’s still 93 point something effective at preventing hospitalization and death.

[uponit7771]

24. ***THANK YOU !!!*** People think the vax's were meant to be inoculation from get. They weren't

[wnylib]

51. So, following through on that logic,

it is reasonable to accept that some infections will occur in vaccinated people. Therefore, it is also reasonable for vaccinated people who have underlying conditions to continue to wear masks.

[lagomorph777]

41. Thanks to Trump for making the variants possible.

A real president would have led the world in masking and other basic public health measures, and prevented millions of deaths. Trump took the opposite course: genocide by feigned incompetence.

[Pobeka]

42. Never stopped wearing the mask indoors, though vaccinated.

Even a 10% risk for symptomatic infection was too high for me to not wear a mask indoors. If a mask reduces the chance of infection by 50% unvaccinated, then after vaccination it reduces my risk from 10% to 5% for symptomatic infection and I'm all in. The more and more data that rolls in for real world data looks like a mask could reduce my risk from 36% to 18%. (For math nerds I'm assuming the effects are linear)

And, though I haven't seen a medical study confirming it yet, I did hear a doctor (on NPR?) saying that it is plausible that a vaccinated person with a symptomatic infection could pass it on, which makes sense to me.

(I do understand that masks can fog up eyeglasses, and that's an issue particularly when shopping, but I think I saw you can just put a bandaid or piece of tape over the top of the mask to prevent exhaled air from going up into your eyeglasses)

For now, eating indoors at a restaurant without socially distanced tables is still not an option. Take out is still the way we opt to "eat out" if outdoor tables are not available. Restaurants still get a good tip from us for take-out.

[BannonsLiver]

45. Is this peer reviewed? Sure doesn't seem like it.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

47. I will be wearing my mask, social distancing, and avoiding public places to the

the greatest extent possible until the last Covidiot Maskhole has been infected, or is dead.

I'm retired and live in a red rural area, next to a huge National Forest, and I'm not going to let some QOP fool kill me, or make me sick at this point.

[themaguffin]

60. It's not that simple

Saw this in a twitter thread about this same news, for what it's worth...

Link to tweet